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Transferring codes between remotes

 
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:03 pm    Post subject: Transferring codes between remotes Reply with quote

Finally have a fair setup on my very old Cinema6 and now turning my attention to the 8910 and working with two different remotes... I did use the 8910 to run the learning captures for building the 7800/6800 updates, so, I'm slightly beyond "start"

Is there any other method than loading individual updates to transfer a complete setup from one remote to another? (I assume the answer is "no")

Related question 1... is it possible to capture "learned codes" (that don't decode into protocols) on one remote and use them on another? (I can see no obvious way within ir to save learned button contents to files.)

Related Question 2... I have several "updates" downloaded from OneForAll where I have no current access to the remotes. Where would I start to build updates from the data downloaded to the 8910 from OFA?

Thanks in advance,
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Nils_Ekberg
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no way I know of to transfer an IR file from one remote to another. I just try to do as much of the work in my RM or KM upgrade files as possible and leave as little as possible to do in IR.

When you do a learn and download it to IR you can obviously save the IR file which will save the learned signal but you have the same problem getting them to another remote.

If you have learned signals that do not translate to a protocol try learning them again. If they come out the same post the IR file here with a link to it and we can see if we can figure out what protocol it is for you. Also, make sure you are using the latest version of DecodeIR.dll before you relearn them.

If you downloaded devices from OFA there is good odds we already have an equivalent RM or KM file in the file area so start there. Just look for the device not what remote it came from because using RM or KM you can change them to any another remote.
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Transferring codes between remotes Reply with quote

bevhoward wrote:
Finally have a fair setup on my very old Cinema6 and now turning my attention to the 8910 and working with two different remotes... I did use the 8910 to run the learning captures for building the 7800/6800 updates, so, I'm slightly beyond "start"

Is there any other method than loading individual updates to transfer a complete setup from one remote to another? (I assume the answer is "no")

What you need to do is open each of your upgrades using KM or RM, then re-configure the upgrade for the new remote. If you think about it, there's really no other way to do it. Each remote has a different arrangement of buttons, so just because a button assignment made sense on your URC-6800 doesn't mean it will make sense on the URC-8910.

bevhoward wrote:
Related question 1... is it possible to capture "learned codes" (that don't decode into protocols) on one remote and use them on another? (I can see no obvious way within ir to save learned button contents to files.)

The short answer is "no". I have asked for a cut & paste mechanism many times, to no avail. It is possible to cut & paste data between the raw IR files, but given your frustrations with the "regular" stuff, I don't think you want to go down that path. The "easy" solution would be to learn the signals from one remote into the other.

However, I'm more interested in what learned signals that you have that can't be converted into keymoves.

bevhoward wrote:
Related Question 2... I have several "updates" downloaded from OneForAll where I have no current access to the remotes. Where would I start to build updates from the data downloaded to the 8910 from OFA?

There is no automated procedure for doing this. Your first move should be to check the file section to see if there's a regular upgrade file for the device in question. If there isn't, post a copy of your IR file (with the upgrades present) in the Diagnosis Area (and post a link to it) and one of us will convert them into upgrade files.
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>> but given your frustrations with the "regular" stuff... <<

I already have a complex... you don't have to reenforce it ;-)

Thanks for the confirmations.
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ElizabethD
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Joined: 09 Feb 2004
Posts: 2303

PostPosted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Transferring codes between remotes Reply with quote

bevhoward wrote:
... (I can see no obvious way within ir to save learned button contents to files.)

The answer to most problems in life is always in Excel Very Happy and IR does give you some tools.

I may have missed a step or two, but try something along these lines.
But only if you know by now enough of KM to know how it should behave.
And if you know exactly what it is you'd be entering by hand and where which you're trying to avoid.

1. Open the file with learned signals in IR.
2. Turn wordrap off.
3. Run Summary to a text file. Or just select the learned signals lines and do ctl-v
4. Paste to a new Excel book.
5. Arrange what data you need to put into KM. Function, OBC, likely byte 2 value(s).
6. Play with it in Excel till you have what you would be typing in KM.
7. Make sure you align your functions, numbers and notes properly
8. Select and copy area(s) matching the column names of KM. Most likely you'll do Functions and OBC and byte as one area, and the notes as the second.
9. On the KM function sheet, paste/special values or text and the transfer is done.
Do not just paste, Paste Special is important.
Careful here. If you mess up in KM, close it all up and start over.
Observing KM rules of good behavior is vital.

If you take this route and something goes wrong, please tell Mark what you did, because this is not exactly your everyday procedure. Commecial vendors Twisted Evil wouldn't support you if you violate the rules.
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underquark
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
bevhoward wrote:
Related question 1... is it possible to capture "learned codes" (that don't decode into protocols) on one remote and use them on another? (I can see no obvious way within ir to save learned button contents to files.)


Quote:
And The Robman replied:
The short answer is "no". I have asked for a cut & paste mechanism many times, to no avail. It is possible to cut & paste data between the raw IR files, but given your frustrations with the "regular" stuff, I don't think you want to go down that path. The "easy" solution would be to learn the signals from one remote into the other.


Am I right in assuming that - in the normal course of events - a code is learned, it gets decoded and a set of values are generated (OBC, hex, EFC), in which case the Excel method will work or one could write a macro to read the relevant parts out of the raw data but that the problem here is that "learned" codes are not getting through the decoding stage and have, therefore, merely been approximately copied rather than learned? In that case, try, try and try again by entering learning mode and pressing each of the numeric keys in turn and firing the source remote repeatedly as you go until, hopefully, one gets learned. If this fails then learn as many of the other keys as you can, score off the ones you already know, look at codes for any similar or related keys and have a guess at what the missing code should be. Embarassed and Sad if my Newbie suggestion is off the mark but Smile if it works as this means that I'm learning something from this forum (even if I haven't fully decoded it yet).
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Mark Pierson
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

underquark wrote:
"learned" codes are not getting through the decoding stage and have, therefore, merely been approximately copied rather than learned?
Perhaps, or the current decoding logic doesn't recognize them. The remote itself simply "records" whatever IR stream it sees. It looks for simple repeat patterns, etc to conserve space but it is up to the DecodeIR.dll or IR's built-in decode logic to extract the pertinent protocol, device, and function details. The fact that a learned signal can't be decoded doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad learn.

IIRC, assuming an easy way to do it, a learned signal from one JP1 remote could be copied into another with only possibly the bound button needing to be changed... they all store learned signals in the same format.
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

underquark wrote:
Am I right in assuming that - in the normal course of events - a code is learned, it gets decoded and a set of values are generated (OBC, hex, EFC), in which case the Excel method will work or one could write a macro to read the relevant parts out of the raw data but that the problem here is that "learned" codes are not getting through the decoding stage and have, therefore, merely been approximately copied rather than learned?

When learned signals are stored in the EEPROM, they are pretty much stored as raw data, the remote doesn't try to convert them into EFCs or OBCs or anything else like that. The fact that they get displayed showing the protocol, device codes and OBCs/EFCs is because the DecodeIR program recognizes the raw data.

The way I read Bev's question was that he wanted to transplant the raw data from one remote to another. This might be because DecodeIR was unable to recognize the signals (and if that's the case, I'd like more info so we can rectify it) or it might be because he's using an unextended remote and he wants to use all of the memory efficiently, so storing some signals as learned signals is totally appropiate in such circumstances.

The possible solutions are as follows:

1) If the signals are decoded, store them as keymoves in the new remote, or add them to your upgrades.

2) Learn the signals from the old remote to the new remote.

3) If you really want to try the cut & paste method (and I apologise if you took offense at my suggestion that this might be a bit complicated), the first thing you should do is verify where the learning section starts by reading the RDF (for the 8910 it starts at $0400 and for the URC-6800 it starts at $03FF. Then you should open both IR files using a text editor (like Notepad). Then you should cut and paste all the data from address $03FF in the URC-6800 over to address $0400 in the URC-8910.

If both remotes used the $0400 address, this would be easy, but in this case, you're going to have to edit the data so that it all lines up properly in the new file. If you're handy with Excel, you could possibly write some formulae to assist you with this.

Then you should open the new file using IR.exe, ignoring the message about a bad checksum. Then go to the Learned Signals tab and verify that the learned signals are bound to the correct button in the correct device mode (as they almost certainly won't be).

All in all, I've got to imagine that this process will take alot more time than learning the signals from one remote to the other.
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 1:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Transferring codes between remotes Reply with quote

bevhoward wrote:
Related Question 2... I have several "updates" downloaded from OneForAll where I have no current access to the remotes. Where would I start to build updates from the data downloaded to the 8910 from OFA?

I was just checking the readme for RM (thanks Liz) and Greg introduced a new feature in version 1.27 called "Import Raw Upgrade" which is described as follows...

Quote:
Imports a raw hex device upgrade. This is useful when a remote is sent back to UEI to have a device upgrade added.

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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2005 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
new feature in RM version 1.27 called "Import Raw Upgrade" which is described as follows...


Thanks... seems like it's time to learn more about RM.

Thanks,
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