JP1 Remotes

[vickyg2003]

[tranx]

I agree about the known state and that this is a fairly frequent problem with such menus, but the second menu always starts at the top, so can be left out of the discussion for now. That leaves the situation where there are eight possible positions for starting the first menu.

One way of (Edited13.1.2015: not "getting to"; instead: "avoiding having to maintain") the known state could be by repeating commands, just as vicky2003 has recommended. However in some circumstances it might be automated relatively simply, so may I ask whether the first menu cycles, or does the cursor get stuck when it gets to the bottom when repeatedly pressing 'down', and if it sticks at the top when repeatedly pressing 'up'?

[tranx]

If the first menu does cycle, and if there are enough spare devices for your purposes, then a device could be used to go to a particular 'blank screen state' from specific devices for 'states', where the menu cursor starting positions would need to be known. The 'go to BS' *button would carry a DSM for the appropriate menu navigation commands, and in each blank screen device the 'return from BS' *button should carry a DSM to reverse those same actions in the first menu, i.e. to return the menu cursor to it's particular 'known position', and only to return to the original device state, no other changes of menu or device being made available.

*button could be the same one for 'go to BS' and 'return from BS' so it would in effect seem to be just 'toggle BS'

[sti491]

Thanks Vickyg2003: “I usually opt for a LKP with recursion. Hold the button down and let it keep looping and then release and let the macro continue.”

I may not need it based on a solution that I think I have for the macro I asked about, to blank the TV screen documented below, but I have a different macro I want to get to Charter Cable's "My Favorite Menu Guide".

On that one I start with CBL/Menu, then there are eight choices that you can cycle right (or left) and it keeps going forever in a loop, until you stop at the "Heart icon", which then needs to be selected to get to the menu I want. That "Heart icon" menu item is the fourth from the left, if that matters. The perfect macro might be "IF: it lands on that Heart fourth from the left, select it. "IF; it doesn't land there, keep looping and until I release to let the macro continue"...

So how would I do that? Have I given you enough info that you could script that macro for me to cut & paste into RM? Even if what I described can't be done, could you script what you suggested to "Hold the button down and let it keep looping and then release and let the macro continue"

Tranx,

“I agree about the known state and that this is a fairly frequent problem with such menus, but the second menu always starts at the top, so can be left out of the discussion for now.” … that is correct.

Your question is a good one: “may I ask whether the first menu cycles, or does the cursor get stuck when it gets to the bottom when repeatedly pressing 'down', and if it sticks at the top when repeatedly pressing 'up'?” Yes, that is what it does! So:

Hit “down” 8 times from the top and it is stuck there at the bottom (you can keep hitting “down” and it just stays there). If you hit “Up” 8 times it does the same thing… it just stays at the top spot until you hit “down” again.

I think, if I am following your last post. A marcro that does this might work: Start by a TV/Menu press, then down 8 times. Then up 6 times (to highlight “Timers”), then select, then down 3 times, select to Blank screen.

Therefore it would look like this in RM:
Dev_TV;Menu;Down;Down;Down;Down;Down;Down; Down;Down;Up:Up:Up:Up:Up:Up:Ok;Down;Down;Down;Ok

I just tried this manually pushing the buttons on the remote from various starting positions in the first menu list. It works! With the extender "fast macro" feature, is there any reason I can't IR learn this macro to from my RCA to my H900 for a single button sequence macro? I hope it's not too long for the H900 to learn by IR (?)... that has been my objective all along.

Will this macro written as I have it work? Seems like we just figured out my answer for the "blank screen" macro! ☺ ...and maybe Vickyg2003's "LKP with recursion" will work for my Charter favorite channel guide one (that I still need help with).

[mdavej]

I hate to say it, but the most a 900 can learn that many commands in one raw learn. And your TV or cable box probably won't be able to process them that fast. Need to start thinking about a simpler approach.

[tranx]

If the slow speed in menus is acceptable, for the Charter Cable's "My Favorite Menu Guide" problem, even if a menu does cycle and using the principle described by vicky2003, the cursor's starting position can be retained by reversing any navigations in the menu after the cursor position has been changed. To reverse any change the alternative DSM could be issued by pressing the B-Menu select button once more, or possibly by pressing again whatever button was used to make the change.

In the example below by first pressing a 'B-Menu select button' on the remote, to set the numeric button set to a particular device state the user could then have 8 'discrete menu select buttons' available. After changing a menu position by pressing a number button, the only way of getting out of that 'B-menu select' mode should either be to press the same button again (to issue the reversing DSM), or (safer) to press the B-Menu select button (which would have the same DSM on it to return the menu to the known state), so that all the paddling might even be transparent to the user

On each of the number buttons in the 'B-menu select button' set, a unique DSM could be used to activate any particular menu item (corresponding to a change of the 'currently remembered position in the menu'). Each of those DSMs would be matched to a unique 'return to the original remembered cursor position in the menu' DSM (reversing the original steps). For safety once the menu had been changed, it might be best to to allocate the appropriate reversing DSM to the chosen 'B-menu select' button, but the same button on the remote could be used for allocation of both members of each matched pair of DSMs, for example as below, and i.e. to toggle in and out of the remembered menu cursor position.

For an eight place menu, eight DSM's, or pairs of DSMs, would be needed. To organise them they could be situated on buttons #1 to #8 in one device's number button set, for changing the menu, and perhaps another device's set or the 'B-menu select button' for the corresponding reverse operations. Most of the commands in the DSM on each digit button would navigate the menu but the macros in either direction (change menu position/reverse change) would finish by adjusting the remote automatically to use the alternate (menu changing/reversing) button set.

In order to preserve a 'known state' the problem cycling menu would need only to be addressed by using that method and in any case after using the menu, those 'reversing' DSMs would need to be used somehow before doing anything else, but two sets of phantom buttons could carry the paired macros instead of sets of number buttons.

[sti491]

mdavej,

Not sure exactly what you mean by this (I get the general meaning of what you are saying, which was my concern unfortunately): I hate to say it, but the most a 900 can learn that many commands in one raw learn. Is there a specific maximum number of button push sequences that I will be able to program in the RCA, to then IR learn to the H900?

For example my CBL "Fav Channel Guide" macro in it's simplest form (if the first menu selection is already on the fourth Heart icon button from the left, where I normally leave it), is only 3 button pushes "Dev_CBL;Menu;Ok;Ok". Could the H900 IR learn that short one, even if some delay had to be added between the command for the CBL DVR box to accept them?

Assuming that short a marco would IR transfer successfully to the H900 as an Extended RCA fast macro, but then it was too fast to work on the cable box, what is the easiest way add delays between the commands in RM?


Tranx,

I am struggling to understand the approach you are describing, because I don't know what you mean by, "by first pressing a 'B-Menu select button' on the remote"... and "On each of the number buttons in the 'B-menu select button' set".

I don't think you mean the "B, or blue button on the remote"? I'll do some searching to see If I can figure out the semantics/terminology you mean by, "'B-menu select button' set"... In the meantime if you read this, perhaps before I figure it out, you could explain further.

I think I conceptually understand what you mean by, "the user could then have 8 'discrete menu select buttons' available."... that is that is, assign the number 1 to the first icon all the way on the left for "Home", a 2 for the next "DVR", 3 for "On Demand", etc. Then instead of commands to navigate right or left, use a command that pushed the command by number. Conceptually I get it, but how do you do that?



Thanks in advance.

[mdavej]

Those 3 commands should work. The 20 or so you posted will not. Pauses are just another step, very easy to add.

On the 900 you have to fool it into thinking your long macro is a single command. Raw mode does this but is limited to a second or two.

[sti491]

Is there another way do it other than "Raw mode"?

I not sure exactly what "raw mode" is, vs "some other mode"?

[tranx]

[sti491]

That's clears a lot up. Thanks! Should getting my cable from China within a week or so. I'll play around some then. Meanwhile, it's an interesting cognitive challenge. Appreciate you hanging in there with me.

[mdavej]

[sti491]

Thanks mdavej. I found raw learn in the Harmony 900 software under "custom" learn. That looks easy. I assume you just point the remotes at each other and IR learn like you would otherwise, except for doing it under "raw learn".

Earlier you said a 3 step macro would work, but the much longer one I proposed wouldn't. About how many sequences do you think I can raw learn to the H900?

[mdavej]

Correct on all counts. Easy, but some trial and error getting a successful learn of a good duration that includes all commands. Plan on doing it several times.

3 to 5 is about the best you can do learning macros from another remote. However, with your JP1 remote and fast macros, you can probably get up to 15 steps. The big caveat is whether your TV can actually see 15 commands in 2 seconds. I've only ever had two devices that could, both were satellite receivers. You'll just have to try it and see. So build your macros and see if they work from the JP1 remote before you try to teach them to your 900.

[sti491]

Got it.

Next step, get that Chinese cable delivered to try some of my newfound knowledge.... which will likely generate more questions then!