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Controlling X10 with RF signals

 
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hummbie



Joined: 21 Sep 2004
Posts: 9
Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 10:24 am    Post subject: Controlling X10 with RF signals Reply with quote

Hi there.

I am looking for a JP1 Remote able to control my X10 equipment with RF signals - not IR. I already have a TM13 tranceiver (european version).

Do you think that RS 15-2117 will do the job?
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Mark Pierson
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3011
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You'll need an IR543 to convert the IR signal from the remote to the X10 powerline signal. The RF capabilities of JP1 remotes are ONLY for use with their respective command centers. They cannot be used to control other RF devices (there is no such thing as a universal RF remote).
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18077
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 3:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Controlling X10 with RF signals Reply with quote

hummbie wrote:
I am looking for a JP1 Remote able to control my X10 equipment with RF signals - not IR.

As long as that is a hard and fast requirement, it's not possible.
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Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
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hummbie



Joined: 21 Sep 2004
Posts: 9
Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2004 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for your replies but IR543 will not work in europe (you know 220V)...

I think I found the proper (rather expensive) european module: IR7243. It doesn't look the same but does exactly the same job - converts IR signals directly into X10. It should be compatible with Philips Pronto remotes.

There is also a cheaper solution: Powermid to convert IR signals into RF signals (such as those send by X10 remotes) but I am not sure if this would work for me. What do you think?
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18077
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2004 8:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, you could get a voltage converter to step your 220v down to 110v (you know, the kind of thing that travellers often need) or you could get an IR543 box and attempt to modify it to use an external power supply, like what Paul King did in order to use an RF extender box in the UK.

Read this...
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2935
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Rob
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mr_d_p_gumby
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 1370
Location: Newbury Park, CA

PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2004 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There might be a problem with trying to use a voltage converter on the IR543. Remember that it also has to inject the X10 PLC signals into the power line, and the voltage converter may block them. I would imagine the IR543 could be modified to work on 220v as it uses the same capacitor-zener type power supply as most other X10 stuff, but the bigger question is will it work on 50 Hz?
hummbie wrote:
There is also a cheaper solution: Powermid to convert IR signals into RF signals (such as those send by X10 remotes) but I am not sure if this would work for me. What do you think?
No, this won't work for X10. The X10 IR signals are completely different from the X10 PLC signals on the power lines, and they are both different from the signals X10 uses for RF. Also, the Powermids will not be tuned to the same frequency as the X10 RF receivers.
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 18077
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2004 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mr_d_p_gumby wrote:
There might be a problem with trying to use a voltage converter on the IR543. Remember that it also has to inject the X10 PLC signals into the power line, and the voltage converter may block them.

That's a good point. That might also rule out using a seperate AC transformer like what Paul did in the other thread I linked to. The best solution would probably be to modify the unit to run on 220v, assuming the 50hz thing isn't an issue.
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pgk



Joined: 21 Aug 2004
Posts: 113
Location: London

PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2004 4:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've seen various guides on converting US modules to European voltages by changing 5-10 components, but none specfically covering the IR modules.

But the impression I've had is that if buying components "retail", then by the time you've paid for the shipping from the US and the cost of the components it's not always that much cheaper, especially if your not 100% certain what you are doing and since it's non-isolated mains electricity can be difficult/dangerous to test.

I found the 7243 module here for 32 + shipping.

Paul
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hummbie



Joined: 21 Sep 2004
Posts: 9
Location: Vienna, Austria

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It has almost the same price as the unit I found in Belgium. Actually the point is that I don't like pointing the remote to some unit in order to switch on the lights. Think of a long macro involving more then one X10 commands. And besides I already have a RF remote which works fine with this receiver. I am looking for a better solution!

So, I have now another idea... I opened my KR22 - "Credit Card" Keyfob RF Remote and found a small transistor like RF transmitter inside.
It's obvious that this component ensures the proper frequency/modulation to carry out the X10 signal to the TM13 RF receiver. I wonder if it can be used for the RS 15-2117 remote to make it RF compatible to the TM13 RF receiver. What do you think?
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pgk



Joined: 21 Aug 2004
Posts: 113
Location: London

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

> I wonder if it can be used for the RS 15-2117 remote to make it RF compatible to the TM13 RF receiver.

Probably not, as far as I am aware the 2117 puts all the data onto the carrier RF signal, including the IR modulation, I would doubt that X10 works like that. But maybe some who knows the hardware you have and the 2117 would be able to better comment.

Regarding the not wanting to aim the remote at the IR receiver whilst running macros this is where remotes like the 2117 with a separate command centre come in useful. Line the IR output of the Command Center up with the X10 IR receiver in somewhere out of the way. The RF transmit from the 2117 to the Command Center will then operate the X10 IR receiver.
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captain



Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:33 am    Post subject: IR *conversion* Reply with quote

I have a (albeit now dead) device that will convert any IR transmitter into an RF transmitter. It's called a LeapFrog. I got it circa 1995 and used it, duct taped to the front of my RadioShack 6in1 AV Remote to control all my AV/HT gear, as well as my X10 system from *anywhere in the house*! It was a ridiculous hack but it worked great.

Hey! It may still exist! Check it out and give me some amazon.com credit for the referral. Wink

http://www.amazon.com/dp/product/B00006JQJQ?tag=j0df-20

PS: It seems that by now someone should have created a WI-FI enabled Universal Remote Controller - perhaps as a PDA application, so one could simply have his cell-phone/PDA/RemoteControl in a pocket and have access to everything via ONE wireless medium. Now that I've invented the concept, watch someone else make a million with it in about 5-10 years. (story of my life Smile
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