JP1 Remotes

Getting Kenwood VR-410 which is operated by rf an has no i.r. receiver to work with universal remote URC-9800B01 and JP1.


RF remote that came with kenwood is RC-R0810 It has a switch under battery cover with a total of 3 rf configurations possible so this will probably work for the other kenwood rf models as well such as vr-5900,vr-5700,vr-5090,RC-R0913 Etc......


Ive had my URC-9800B01 with extender for quite sometime but havent used it due to my kenwood vr-410 having no i.r. reciever and only working off r.f. I recently stumbled upon the jp1 group and forums from shspvr forums and was able to make the cable and program the 9800 to my exact liking.My only problem was this receiver was causing me to have to use 2 remotes so I was about to buy a new receiver. But befor I dished out the money I wanted to see what I could do. First thing I did was take apart the vr-410 to be sure the reason it couldnt be controlled via i.r. was for the lack of an i.r. receiver. The board looks like its designed to work with i.r. but looks like it would need about 3 parts to work capacitor,diode and resistor of which i have none so i put it back together. Next I wanted to see if maybe the RC-R0810 had the spot on the remote somewhere for the jp1 but just wasnt used so I took apart the remote nothing that resembled the jp1 and even if there had been I would have no rdf file to get it to work although if there had been a jp1 I would have asked for some help but i decided to put it back together and move on to my next idea.

I noticed a while ago that when the switch on the RC-R0810 was set to first position the repeater for the URC-9800B01 would extend the i.r. signals of the RC-R0810. I downloaded some of the other kenwood codes from http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jp1/files ... des/Audio/ and put them into the URC-9800B01 then pointed the URC-9800B01 into the RC-R0810 and had the RC-R0810 learn the codes. these would control the vr-410 over the rf even though they were learned through I.R.
I disassembled both remotes and put them side by side and did some tests with the rf transmitter boards of the remotes. Next I decided that swapping the rf boards could possibly work so removed them and tried and wahlah works perfect.

Things I used to do this were:
URC-9800B01
RC-R0810
soldering iron
desoldering braid
small philips screw driver
small wire cut from old ide ribbon
kenwood device codes from http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jp1/files ... des/Audio/

If anyone thinks it may be possible to to incorporate a jp1 or stereo plug into RC-R0810 let me know and ill give it a shot I can also give close up pics of the board if it will help.

Ryan

ryanmc wrote:Kenwood VR-410

ryanmc wrote:swapping the rf boards could possibly work so removed them and tried and wahlah works perfect.

Let me see if I understand what you just described:

You moved the rf board from a Kenwood remote to a URC-9800. You used a standard Kenwood code set (for a Kenwood IR controlled device) in the 9800 and the result controlled the VR-410 by RF.

I assume the 9800 is no longer compatible with its original base station, so you can't use it as originally designed (put the base station with IR controlled equipment in another room and/or in a cabinet and have the 9800 control that IR equipment without line of sight). I assume you had no need to use it that way.

I guess this means that the Kenwood rf design layers a signal designed for IR onto an RF carrier in the same way that the 9800 does. The only difference is the frequency of the RF carrier.

the rf from the kenwood remote worked with the 9800 base so yes it is still compatible

ryanmc wrote:Getting Kenwood VR-410 which is operated by rf an has no i.r. receiver to work with universal remote URC-9800B01 and JP1.

OK. It looks like you want to use the Kenwood remote to control all of your devices. But based on things you said later in the post, it also appears as though the 9800 (or other UEIC IR/RF remotes) may work to control your receiver. I'll explain why this may be later.

ryanmc wrote:RF remote that came with kenwood is RC-R0810 It has a switch under battery cover with a total of 3 rf configurations possible so this will probably work for the other kenwood rf models as well such as vr-5900,vr-5700,vr-5090,RC-R0913 Etc......

The receiver also has the ability to switch the RF frequency that it responds to. The remote and receiver have to be on the same setting for the remote to work.

ryanmc wrote:Ive had my URC-9800B01 with extender for quite sometime but havent used it due to my kenwood vr-410 having no i.r. reciever and only working off r.f. I recently stumbled upon the jp1 group and forums from shspvr forums and was able to make the cable and program the 9800 to my exact liking.

Good. Maybe you would like to continue to use that remote?

ryanmc wrote:My only problem was this receiver was causing me to have to use 2 remotes so I was about to buy a new one. But befor I dished out the money I wanted to be sure I couldnt make due with what I had. First thing I did was take apart the vr-410 to be sure the reason it couldnt be controlled via i.r. was for the lack of an i.r. receiver. The board looks like its designed to work with i.r. but looks like it would need about 3 parts to work capacitor,diode and resistor of which i have none so i put it back together.

It may also be necessary to change the firmware of the receiver to accept IR. Hard to tell, and without knowing the part values for these components, way more headache thatn it's worth.

ryanmc wrote:Next I wanted to see if maybe the RC-R0810 had the spot on the remote somewhere for the jp1 but just wasnt used so I took apart the remote nothing that resembled the jp1 and even if there had been I would have no rdf file to get it to work although if there had been a jp1 I would have asked for some help but i decided to put it back together and move on to my next idea.

I don't know if this remote was originally made by UEIC or not, but if not, no jp1. It is only for their remotes.

ryanmc wrote:I noticed a while ago that when the switch on the RC-R0810 was set to first position the repeater for the URC-9800B01 would extend the i.r. signals of the RC-R0810.

This is very interesting. It means that the Kenwood remote, when set to that position/frequency uses the same (+/-) frequency as the 9800 or other UEIC IR?RF remotes. This is promising. It probably also means that you don't use "RF BAND 1" in your receiver. If you did, you may actually have found that the 9800 controls at least some of the functions of your receiver.

ryanmc wrote:I downloaded some of the other kenwood codes from http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jp1/files ... des/Audio/ and put them into the URC-9800B01 then pointed the URC-9800B01 into the RC-R0810 and had the RC-R0810 learn the codes. these would control the vr-410 over the rf even though they were learned through I.R.

This is because the remote modulates the RF signal based on the IR signal.

ryanmc wrote:I disassembled both remotes and put them side by side and did some tests with the rf transmitter boards of the remotes. Next I decided that swapping the rf boards could possibly work so removed them and tried and wahlah works perfect...If anyone thinks it may be possible to to incorporate a jp1 or stereo plug into RC-R0810 let me know and ill give it a shot I can also give close up pics of the board if it will help.
xact1974@yahoo.com
Ryan

Again, you may be able to use the 9800 remote with your reciever AND everything else. If you are up for it, try putting the RF boards back in their original remotes. Then set the receiver to RF BAND 1 with the remote (it tells you in the manual how to do this). Now in the 9800 use the same Kenwood setup code that you used to teach the other remote and try some commands that you learned to see if they work your receiver. If so, best of both worlds. If not, it's probably got to do with the sequence and timing differences of the sent commands.
Jim

My response was too long and in composing it I missed two responses!

johnsfine wrote: Let me see if I understand what you just described:

You moved the rf board from a Kenwood remote to a URC-9800.

I think he is actually wanting to use the Kenwood remote, and moved the 9800 board to it.?

johnsfine wrote:You used a standard Kenwood code set (for a Kenwood IR controlled device) in the 9800 and the result controlled the VR-410 by RF.

I think yes and no. Yes, he used the standard code set, but learned the commands to the Kenwood remote. From there the Kenwood remote was able to control receiver commands as if they were native to it.

johnsfine wrote:I guess this means that the Kenwood rf design layers a signal designed for IR onto an RF carrier in the same way that the 9800 does.

The same assumption I made.

johnsfine wrote:The only difference is the frequency of the RF carrier.

I think that RF BAND 1 is the same RF freq.
Jim

I didnt see the "rf range" thing wouldve beena much easier solution. if i swap em back ill get the answer for ya

Is there an FCC id written anywhere on the Kenwood remote? If so, please post it as that will enable us to get alot more info on this remote and it's RF features.

Also, as there are several Kenwood files in the Audio folder, could you please state which one you actually used.

fcc id: I0M701312
canada: 2821031879
right now im using codes 1206 and 1313 not sure what they correspond with in the file area but i think i used
Kenwood - With Room B Functions.txt
and
Kenwood VR Recievers.txt

Here's a link to the FCC Data for that Kenwood remote. It states here that it operates on three different RF freqs: 422, 425 and 428 MHz. The URC-9800 operates at 430 MHz.

The Robman wrote:It states here that it operates on three different RF freqs: 422, 425 and 428 MHz. The URC-9800 operates at 430 MHz.

The first linked document states that the channel spacing is 3 MHz (duh, like we couldn't subtract?), which means that the tolerances of these carriers could be as much as +/-1.5MHz. If the tolerance of the 9800 base station is as loose, it would explain the overlap in the frequency and the repeat (via the base station) of the Kenwood signals. If the tolerance on the receiver were as loose, it is very possible that the 9800 or another IR/RF remote could control the receiver.

I've been trying for years to find a simple way to control this receiver with a universal remote as the original one will not do what I want it to. To my suprise I stumbled upon the Philips brand 'PH750T'. With the receiver on Band 2 and the remote code 588 used the remote works like a dream. It doesn't have all the commands I need, but that was fixed quick by teaching them from a harmony 880. It worked for me, I hope it works for you too.