Denon AVR-4802

krbuck · Post by **krbuck** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:45 am

1. Device: Denon AVR-4802
2. Type of device: Amp/Tuner
3. Year: 2003
4. JP1 Remote model: RS 15-2117
5. JP1 user? Yes
6. Still have original remote? Yes
7. Checked the file section? Yes
8. Checked Pronto file section (at R/C)? Yes (exists)
9. Partially working setup code? Yes
10. Learning remote question? No

I have some learned codes from my old 15-2116 (I'm setting up RF with a 2117) and found a couple of CCFs over at the RC site, but I wanted to be sure there isn't already a good upgrade that covers all the functions on this component before trying to build the upgrade myself. I have never built an upgrade from scratch, so I'd like to avoid that if possible.

There is a CCF or two available on the RC site. I've imported the DecodeCCF output into a spreadsheet, but just don't want to go further until I hear all the work is necessary. Also, I'm a bit stuck as to what to do next.

If anyone is game to help with the upgrade, I'd be happy to post the txt output.

And of course: Thanks!

--Karl

johnsfine · Post by **johnsfine** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:12 am

When you say "yes" to partially working setup code, you're supposed to tell us which one. There is enough Denon data floating around, I'm sure we could look a few things up and deduce which one, but you'll get faster and/or better answers if you provide the basic info.

Many of the current Denon products mix two totally different protocols in one device: The Denon version of the Sharp protocol for most functions and the Denon version of the Kaseikyo protocol for advanced functions (that often are missing from the original remote).

I don't know if the 4802 uses any Kaseikyo commands.

Denon has pdf files available for download for several models, documenting the IR commands including those missing from the original remote. You might want to look for that file for your model.

If you do need to mix a few Kaseikyo commands with a code set that mainly consists of Denon (version of Sharp) commands, it's easiest to make an empty upgrade for Denon Kaseikyo and use it as the base for KeyMoves (most cleanly done as external function in RM).

If you don't need any Kaseikyo commands, one Denon code set is pretty much the same as another. You could start with the posted Denon upgrade for any model and see which commands are missing or incorrect (should be very few). Then use the decodes you have to add or correct them.

Mark Pierson · Post by **Mark Pierson** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:18 am

krbuck wrote:4. JP1 Remote model: RS 15-2117
10. Learning remote question? No

The 2117 is identical to the 2116 with the addition of RF and therefore IS a learning remote as well.

9. Partially working setup code? Yes

It's helpful if you state which code does work.

There's numerous Denon upgrades in the File Section. Have you tried any to see if they work and can be used as a starting point?

krbuck · Post by **krbuck** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 1:14 pm

Thanks for the responses. I'll try to fill in the gaps in my original post.

Yes, I do have a 2116 with learned codes from the original remote. I probably misunderstood the "Learning remote question?" line. Yes, it is learning and I could again get it to learn commands from the aktins remote. I was however hoping for a more comprehensive upgrade file to bring into my new .ir file. If using the learning technique is the best way to go, I'll do that.

Also, is there a way to copy a device/protocol over in one chunk from a .ir/txt file that contains other devices?

I tried a number of the other AVR-XXXX upgrade files available. Some could do some things, others did nothing, but I didn't document all buttons.

I did use DecodeCCF on a file from the RC site, but it looked like a lot of work to get it into an IR file.

Maybe I should just use the learning function, but I can't help but think it would be nice to have an upgrade file to build upon and change over time if needed.

Thanks again.

Post by **The Robman** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 1:53 pm

Denon is pretty consistent with it's codes across models, therefore you should be able to use the following upgrade file as a starting point:

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... ile_id=413

However, rather than spend all this effort trying to find a matching file and then figuring out if the buttons work, etc, it would be alot easier for you to just learn the buttons from your original remote and create a fresh upgrade yourself. Obviously, this method would just give you the buttons that are on your original remote, but once you have that set of codes, you could compare them to the codes used in the various other Denon upgrades and you might possibly find a few additional functions that work on your device, such as discrete power codes, etc.

If you think the process of learning and creating your own upgrade is alot of work, read the following doc to see how easy it really is:

http://www.hifi-remote.com/jp1/help/

krbuck · Post by **krbuck** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 2:18 pm

Robman,

Thanks for the reply. I have a txt file that has my prior setup. Do you recommend going through the learning procedure and creating an upgrade to the IR file, or is it easier to try to transcribe my old txt file which can be loaded with ir.exe?

I tried the latter by the way and wasn't quite sure how to proceed. The obvious path seems to be to use the Devices tab in IR.EXE and transcribe each EFC/Hex value over, but when I enter them, the values change to be something different than what I started. I imagine it has to do with the protocol, but I am too new to this to know.

Post by **The Robman** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 2:49 pm

I'm sorry, but I don't understand the question.

Mark Pierson · Post by **Mark Pierson** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 3:37 pm

krbuck wrote:I have a txt file that has my prior setup.

If that saved file is from the 2116, it can be loaded directly into the 2117 since they're identical (at least from JP1's standpoint). What Rob is saying is that it would be better to learn the OEM commands (or use your existing learns) and create an upgrade with KM or RM.

krbuck · Post by **krbuck** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 4:56 pm

Its going to take a bit of experimentation, but I'll just try copying the device from my old setup on the 2116 into the .ir file for the 2117. I plan to structure it different with more discrete codes and using the scheme of macros for input selection described in Rob's document.

I still don't quite understand exactly how that works, but I should be able to figure it out with some study.

Thanks to everyone that replied!

Mark Pierson · Post by **Mark Pierson** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 6:03 pm

krbuck wrote:Its going to take a bit of experimentation, but I'll just try copying the device from my old setup on the 2116 into the .ir file for the 2117.

There's no need to do anything manually. The file from the 2116 can be used AS IS in the 2117 and edited to your heart's content. When you're done (or even before that) you can upload it directly to the 2117. Internally, the 2116 and 2117 are the SAME remote... nothing needs to be changed to move from one to the other.

In other words, you don't need to reinvent the wheel.

Post by **The Robman** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 9:15 pm

I'm reading between the lines here, but what I think he's saying is that there are already some upgrades in his 15-2116 but he no longer has the upgrade files for them. Furthermore, he not only wants to copy the upgrades from the 15-2116 to the 15-2117, but he also wants to add a few EFCs to them in the process, which of course means editing the upgrades in either KM or RM.

I still recommend learning the buttons from the original remote just to see what the codes really are, then comparing those codes to the upgrade that I linked to earlier. But, there is an alternative. If the upgrades that are already in the 15-2116 are close to perfect, you can import them as raw upgrades using RM.

If my summary of the situation is correct, what happened to the upgrade files that were used to create the upgrades that are in the 15-2116?

gfb107 · Post by **gfb107** » Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:29 pm

I just found and fixed a bug in RM's importing of raw (and binary) upgrade files. Use RM v1.44 (or later) if you are going to import your raw upgrades.

krbuck · Post by **krbuck** » Thu Jan 19, 2006 9:56 am

I decided to just build on the Denon 2805 which seems to have most of the functions working. I'll just need to add in a few things.

I apologize if I didn't explain my objectives very well; I haven't messed with JP1 for a couple years and I'm way rusty. Anyway, here it is again:

I have a current setup for the 2116. I was already aware that I could use this config directly on the 2117. However, I'm intrested in using upgrades which include discretes I don't have and a new structure for macros and moved keys that will make it easier to understand and update in the future. Right now it has a few toggles (vs discretes) and I can barely figure out what I was thinking when I built the original.

So, I've started to add in a couple Denon learned codes and read in the upgrade files. Now I just need to figure out my key move/macros. I've been looking for a few hours at it trying to figure out the best way to do it, but I'm still kind of mystified even with the helpful documentation and improved tools.

No matter; I'll get it.

I'm now reading: http://www.hifi-remote.com/files/help/T ... %20JP1.htm (The What and Why of JP1). It may have some answers for me.

Thanks again for the help!

JP1 Remotes

Denon AVR-4802

Denon AVR-4802

Re: Denon AVR-4802