JP1 Remotes

[broken]

Remote still worked after the new protocol but the issue is the same, the 8811 learns it and works, the MX-500 does not, here's an IR where the 8811 has learned from the Dreambox remote on L1 and L2 and learned second hand from the MX-500 on L3 and L4,

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=1744

[johnsfine]

[broken]

wow, I'm learning alot, which is kinda the reason I got into this

[johnsfine]

I've never before tried to hit timing targets as exactly as this protocol seems to require. But I've patched that Protocol again, keeping the frequency shift and adding a general slowdown which I think should be as near to 2.5% as you could get within the structure of this upgrade.

Try this one in the usual ways (does the Dreambox remote still work? Learn Dreambox to 8811. Learn Dreambox to MX-500 to 8811. Does the MX-500 work?)

It also would help to learn a few different digit commands Dreambox to MX-500 to 8811 (with this new upgrade) to see how much the learning glitches are specific to this problem signal vs. a consisten shift of all the timing.

Upgrade protocol 0 = 01 6c (S3C80) Manual Settings
3D 7D 42 8B 05 00 00 6D 01 6C 6C 03 F6 80 99 E4
07 09 E4 08 0A E4 03 07 E4 04 08 F0 08 56 08 0F
6C 07 F6 80 99 F6 80 38 FB 0D 46 08 80 6C 07 F6
80 99 F6 80 38 7B FB AF 28 03 F6 80 71 28 04 F6
80 71 28 05 F6 80 71 28 06 F6 80 91 C6 F8 19 64
F6 01 45 28 07 F6 80 71 28 08 F6 80 71 28 09 F6
80 71 28 0A F6 80 91 C6 F8 9B 47 F6 01 45 8D 01
0A 48 C2 F0 C2 F6 80 7D 28 C4 8D 80 7D 1C 12 F6
01 39 56 C2 0F 6B 09 C6 F8 00 3F F6 01 45 2A F7
AF F6 80 71 1C 12 8D 01 39 38 C6 C7 03 F0 C0 3E
C7 13 F6 80 C1 3E C7 13 F6 80 C1 3E C7 13 F6 80
C1 60 C0 0E 56 C0 0F C7 26 56 C2 F0 42 20 D7 62
AF 28 C1 F0 C1 02 12 02 01 AF
End

[broken]

Okay, after this latest upgrade the Dreambox remote no longer works but somewhat as intended, when the ON is learned onto the MX-500 the ON button works as Channel Up ( or Down, Prev or Next ), when learned onto the 8811 from the Dreambox remote does nothing, when learned onto the MX-500 then the 8811 has the same channel changing behaviour.

File has Dreambox ON > 8811 on L1 and L2, Dreambox ON > MX-500 > 8811 on L3 and L4,

http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=1747

I kind of assumed you knew this but perhaps not, most buttons on the Dreambox remote learn fine onto the MX-500, it's a handful that don't,

Power ON / OFF ( the one we're working with )
Direction UP
OK
EXIT

And others I don't recall offhand, some do nothing ( like ON / OFF ) and others do unexpected things.

[johnsfine]

I guess the 8811 is not a good enough IR learner to tell us what the MX-500 is really sending, and the MX-500 is probably not a good enough learner to ever get that power toggle signal right. But there is another way to get things working.

Just to make sure I understand what's happening, I see in the command list one named "Bouquet-". Do you know which button that is and what it does? It looks to me like the MX-500 mislearns the altered power signal so that if it does anything at all it would be "Bouquet-".

Your description of what the mislearned power key actually does "Channel Up ( or Down, Prev or Next )" confuses me. Do you mean you don't know which of those it is, or it randomly does one of them or multiple learns of it act differently, or what?

For the solution:

1) Notice the description in this post
http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/mboard/rc-discrete/thread.cgi?2031,1#1
of an xml file in the linux system. Can you find and edit that file?

2) In IR.EXE for your Dreambox v3 remote, there is a Devices tab, in which SAT:0031 should be selected. Then you can see the Hex Command for each button.

3) In the file from (1), notice lines such as
key name="power" code="0f"
Notice that the Hex command for power in IR.EXE is 0F 00. The hex values correspond that way for all the keys, and that correspondence is the only way the Linux system knows which key is which.

4) You can pick a different hex code for any function you're having trouble with and change that function in both places and it all should work.

5) Changing it in IR.EXE is a bit less obvious than on the LInux side: Note the approximate postion of the code (such as 0F) in the readable list. Then press Edit to see a dense block. The 0F is about the same fraction of the way through the dense as it was in the list. Change the code (just 2 digits, not the following 00) in that dense block, then press OK and check that changed as expect in the readable list.

Make sure you select a function code that is not already used by any other function.

Some function codes are easier for the MX-500 to learn and some are harder. If I'm understanding the issues right, the function codes A6, 6A, 10 and 18 should be easier to learn and don't seem to be already used.

I think the altered version of the protocol does make it easier for the MX-500 to learn, even though it wasn't good enough to learn power. So try those new function codes first with the altered protocol. If that doesn't work, switch back to an earlier protocol.

[broken]

Yeah I'd read about that file, there are a number of problems though. The Dreambox is based on open source images, these images all work a little different hence upgrades would probably invalidate this file which isn't so bad, bigger problem is a lot of Dreambox functionality is based on plugins, these plugins do not use that file for key definitions and therefore would not function properly with the new setup.

A little more investigation showed that the latest protocol upgrade had all the problem keys still not learning, I did a break down of what's not learning,

Key - Learns As

0
1
3
5
7
9
Up
OK - Right
Exit - Yellow / Pause
Power - Bouquet Down
Last Channel
Next Channel
Radio / Record
Vol Down - Vol Up
Bouquet Up - Bouquet Down

All the odd numbers being out seems curious to me, I'm trying to find some connection between the non-working keys.

[broken]

Having a look at the codes, these are the non-functioning ones ( dashes indicate working codes, dash arrow indicates functions as )

00 00
01 00
-
03 00
-
05 00
-
07 00
-
09 00
-
0B 00 -> 0A 00
-
0D 00 -> 0E 00
-
0F 00 -> 0E 00
50 00
51 00
52 00
-
-
-
21 00
-
-
-
25 00 -> 24 00

[johnsfine]

[johnsfine]

Notice that individual digits changed. I'm pretty sure F's consistently change to E's and 9's consistently change to A's and 5's consistently change to 4's, and some errors are ignored.

I'm pretty sure 1's do not change to 2's.

Because of that I was wondering whether the 2'nd digit matters. If the 2'nd digit mattered in the 2'nd version then OK and Exit couldn't be misread as Right and Yellow. If it mattered in the first version then Power couldn't be misread as Bouquet down.

But if the second digit didn't matter as all then the 5 key would be misread as the 4, key, which you said it wasn't.

So I can only conclude the 2'nd digit half matters. Each learn (each keypress) includes both versions of that key. If the second hex digit is right in either version the Linux system seems to accept it.

So how does Bouquet Up get misread as Bouquet Down? The D must be misread as E, which is quite unexpected, but not wholly unreasonable, and either the 3 must be misread as 2 or the B must be misread as A. It is totally unreasonable for the 3 to be misread as 2. So I expect the B is misread as A. This misread in two directions together on similar values (B down to A and D up to E) must be code cleaning not distortion and I think that particular example of MX-500 code cleaning is very different from the 8811 code cleaning.

[The Robman]

[broken]

But I just bought the MX-500 and it was three times the cost of the 8811! Plus I dig the LCD named buttons. I've edited the XML file on the Dreambox ( which as johnsfine suspected does actually work for plugins, the important ones at least ) I've swapped the commands which the MX-500 couldn't learn with others that are unused. There's still some suspect behaviour, ie, some digits will not function on certain text entry fields,
some commands will not repeat ( hold down repeat ). But I've got all the commands and discrete on and off remapped and learnt so it's good to go. I'll just have to re-upload the file when I switch or upgrade images. Thanks for all your help johnsfine, I've a new understanding of all this stuff now.

[The Robman]

How much control does that file give you? I wonder if it's possible to make the Dreambox respond to a different signal all together.
_________________
Rob
www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!

[johnsfine]

[johnsfine]