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Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH &
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 12:05 pm    Post subject: Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH & Reply with quote

Hi all. I am new and have been doing my research on upgrading my URC-7800. So far, I have upgraded the remote for:

NEC PX-42XM2A/S Plasma:
KM Upgrade nec-plasma-050317.txt temporarily until finalized so I can put it on the Yahoo server. Cool things on my upgrade:
Discrete RGB 1 2 3, Video 1 2 3, and HD input selections, also discrete Auto Picture adjust (for PC signals).

LG LST-3510A DVD/HDTV:
KM Upgrade lg_lst-3000-series_hdtv_050319.txt temporarily also. Cool new thing added in my file is TV/INPUT mapped to TV/VCR button on remote.

PROBLEMS:
[1] After doing the upgrade for the LG, the volume and mute lock no longer work when the remote is on DVD/LD (LG Device). It still works in all other modes (TV, VCR, SAT, CD, etc). I notice on IR that VPT Device is set to RCV and is ON. Trying to set it to OFF then back ON didn't help. Trying the volume Lock procedure per the manual (SETUP + 993) didn't help either. Only DVD/LD has no volume lock now. Any ideas?

[2] The original LG remote has two sections: HDTV/STB controls, and DVD controls:

HDTV controls: NEC1 protocol, Device 247 (subDev 247 optional)
DVD controls: NECx1 protocol, Device 45.45

I tried to use a 2DEV KM file but was not able to make it work with TWO PROTOCOLS involved. I found myself having to TEACH/LEARN the DVD functions on the URC-7800. Any tricks to use one device upgrade with functions fron TWO protocols with TWO device settings?

Upcoming upgrades planned:

Pioneer VSX-D608 Digital Surround Receiver
Sony CDP-CX300 CD Carousel
SAMSUNG DSB-4700F SAT Receiver
dish Network 3700 SAT Receiver
JVC HR-J620U VHS VCR

THX.
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johnsfine
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Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 3:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH & Reply with quote

VelociRacer wrote:
[1] After doing the upgrade for the LG, the volume and mute lock no longer work when the remote is on DVD/LD


That is nomal (and frequently inconvenient). Any time the device type of the setup code assigned to a device key is different from the default device type of that key, VPT doesn't work with that device key.

You could replace VPT with three KeyMoves, or you could redo that upgrade using the default device type of the device you you will assign it to,.

VelociRacer wrote:
HDTV controls: NEC1 protocol, Device 247 (subDev 247 optional)
DVD controls: NECx1 protocol, Device 45.45


There is a device combiner protocol that allows any combination of commands from protocols that use one-byte hex commands (as those do). It makes a much bigger upgrade than you'd need otherwise, but you probably have enough upgrade memory available.
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Mark Pierson
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3010
Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 3:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH & Reply with quote

VelociRacer wrote:
HDTV controls: NEC1 protocol, Device 247 (subDev 247 optional)
DVD controls: NECx1 protocol, Device 45.45

I tried to use a 2DEV KM file but was not able to make it work with TWO PROTOCOLS involved. I found myself having to TEACH/LEARN the DVD functions on the URC-7800. Any tricks to use one device upgrade with functions fron TWO protocols with TWO device settings?

The 2DEV protocol should work for that. On the Setup sheet, specify:

Protocol Name: NEC 2DEV Combo
Device1: 247
Sub-Dev1: 247
Device2: 45
Sub-Dev2: 45
NEC Style: 1

On the Functions sheet, enter the appropriate EFC's. For the HDTV signals, the byte2 column should contain "1 1" (first pair, NEC1), and for the DVD signals byte2 should be "2 x1" (second pair, NECx1).

The 7800 doesn't contain that protocol, so be sure to paste the protocol code into IR along with the upgrade.
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jon_armstrong
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 1238
Location: R.I.P. 3/25/2005

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark, I realize (now) that that this pretty well documented in the functions tab if you select NEC 2DEV combo in KM, but my first instinct was to read the keymap-master-protocols.txt and that was confusing to say the least. The NEC combo protocol descriptions are split between one and two byte versions and I don't think any description in the readme file fits how NEC1 Combo/Protocol $01A1 is used. Maybe just an entry like:

"NEC1 Combo/Protocol $01A1 can be used with any combinations of device and sub-device and NEC protocol variant (NEC1, NEC2, NECx1, NECx2 etc). See instructions in the function tab"

In the functions tab I would add "put a space between <pair> and <NEC>"

The reason I mention this is I was already reading Rob's disassembly of $005A to see how to put the control bit in the variable data and you, Rob, Mike, or some other clever person has already done that Smile
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Mark Pierson
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Joined: 03 Aug 2003
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Location: Connecticut, USA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jon_armstrong wrote:
read the keymap-master-protocols.txt and that was confusing
Like everything else JP1, the documentation is always the last to get updated? Embarassed

I don't think we ever update the readme (as you pointed out) when Rob added (or had me do it) the 2DEV support to KM. I'll see about getting it done.
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH & Reply with quote

johnsfine wrote:
VelociRacer wrote:
[1] After doing the upgrade for the LG, the volume and mute lock no longer work when the remote is on DVD/LD


That is nomal (and frequently inconvenient). Any time the device type of the setup code assigned to a device key is different from the default device type of that key, VPT doesn't work with that device key.

You could replace VPT with three KeyMoves, or you could redo that upgrade using the default device type of the device you you will assign it to,.


Thank you very much. Problem fixed! Changed the device type in my KM upgrade file from Video Acc to DVD and the Vol/Mute buttons now locked. A new problem came up. SLEEP button, which I had CC/Subtitle mapped to it, was available in Video Acc device type. But when I changed it to DVD, SLEEP became a KeyMove. But it didn't work as my CC/Subtitle button after this device change. So I had to move the CC/Subtitle to 3L which had a less important ZOOM mapped to it. I ran out of buttons to use. SLEEP and the MACROS are all KeyMoves.
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Lessons learned: NEC, LG, SAMSUNG, SONY, PIONEER, DISH & Reply with quote

Mark Pierson wrote:
The 2DEV protocol should work for that. On the Setup sheet, specify:

Protocol Name: NEC 2DEV Combo
Device1: 247
Sub-Dev1: 247
Device2: 45
Sub-Dev2: 45
NEC Style: 1

On the Functions sheet, enter the appropriate EFC's. For the HDTV signals, the byte2 column should contain "1 1" (first pair, NEC1), and for the DVD signals byte2 should be "2 x1" (second pair, NECx1).


Problem fixed! Thank you as well. One thing to note, Device1 = 247, but Sub-Dev1 = nothing. Let KM figure it out and it will work. KM upgrade file updated in link on my original post.
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

New KM Upgrade file for URC-7800:
SAMSUNG DSB-4700F SAT Receiver
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
Posts: 19807
Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Sun Mar 20, 2005 10:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please upload your files, even if they are incomplete, to the current JP1 file section (there's a link at the top of this page) so that other people can also use them.

If you improve any of the files later, you can easily re-load them. The new file section even allows for a version number, if you want to keep track of your updates.
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www.hifi-remote.com
Please don't PM me with remote questions, post them in the forums so all the experts can help!
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will do Rob. Thanks

Any idea as to why the SLEEP button (CC/Subtitle mapped to it) no longer works once the device type was changed from Video Acc (Cable?) to DVD for the DVD/LD device button on URC-7800, thus forcing a KeyMove for SLEEP?
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
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Location: Chicago, IL

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

VelociRacer wrote:
Any idea as to why the SLEEP button (CC/Subtitle mapped to it) no longer works once the device type was changed from Video Acc (Cable?) to DVD for the DVD/LD device button on URC-7800, thus forcing a KeyMove for SLEEP?

That's an easy one. Each device mode contains a different sub-set of buttons, corresponding to what UEI believes are needed for each device mode. Evidently they don't think that DVD devices have SLEEP buttons.

Does the keymove work? Older remotes like the URC-7800 usually have a built-in sleep function which prevents keymoves from working on this button. I know that you can't do keymoves onto SLEEP with the 15-1994, which is very similar to the URC-7800 (from a functionality point of view).
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Rob
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johnsfine
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Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA

PostPosted: Mon Mar 21, 2005 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't used a 7800 in a long time, and haven't used one without an extender in even longer. But as best I recall, the unextended 7800 lets you define an ordinary signal on Sleep, instead of its built-in sleep timer, ONLY via an upgrade (with an appropriate device type), NOT by KeyMove.
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yyz



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2007 2:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, nearly 2 years later and using the search function here, you guys have solved my NEC1 multi device problems. Thanks !!
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YYZ
URC 6131n
JP1 USB interface
IR v. 7.15
KM v. 9.19
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ElizabethD
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Joined: 09 Feb 2004
Posts: 2333

PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2007 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If, in the next two years, you plan to do some work, do check the Software section and get your tools updated Smile
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=9
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Liz
Tweeking 8910, HTPro/9811, C7-7800, 6131o, 6131n, AtlasOCAP-1056B01, RCA-RCRP05B and enjoying the ride Smile
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VelociRacer



Joined: 04 Nov 2004
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Thu Feb 22, 2007 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, this one is still alive Smile I've recently switched to Logitech Harmony (360 to be exact) and haven't looked back. Still have the OFA URC-7800 as it was the key to teach the Harmony some missing LG HD/DVD remote functions. For some reason, the Harmony doesn't learn properly straight from the LG remote, but it does fine learning from the URC-7800.

I highly recommend the Harmony remotes. It takes minutes to get 90% of your programming needs. The last 10% will take you days but the result is well worth it.
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