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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 6:54 pm    Post subject: Alternate PID ( Reply with quote

I'm trying to get restarted after a few years away plus switching to RemoteMaster (v2.02 Beta) after a few years using Keymapmaster.

My first task is to get the "Philips 47PFL7422D LCD All Functions" update http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=8024 loaded onto a 6131nw.

Of course, as soon as I loaded the above rmdu with the 6131nw selected, I get;

"Protocol ID conflicts with a built-in protocol. To use both this and the built-in protocol in device upgrades, this one needs to be given an Alternate PID."

The rmdu's default's are;
remote = URC-8820
pid = "RC6/5 Combo" (01 84)

This update includes the note;

"Combines up to three RC6 device codes with all RC5 device codes."

Can anyone clarify what's going on?

Also, which protocol I should fall back to and how do I change it without loosing all of the command settings? (If I change the protocol, all function assignments are wiped out)

Thanks in advance,
Beverly Howard
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mdavej
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm... I can't replicate your issue. Works fine for me on 2.02 beta 1.5r.

Here are the commands from it, if that helps. Forgive the terrible formatting. I can't seem to fix it.
(EDIT: Thanks for fixing it, Rob!)
Code:
Name             EFC5   EFC Type 5Dev 5OBC 6Dev 6OBC  Hex  Notes
0                19000  018  RC6   31   0  n/a   0  00 FD 
1                16952  010  RC6   30   0  n/a   1  01 FD 
2                23096  034  RC6   29   0  n/a   2  02 FD 
3                21048  026  RC6   28   0  n/a   3  03 FD 
4                10808  242  RC6   27   0  n/a   4  04 FD 
5                08760  234  RC6   26   0  n/a   5  05 FD 
6                14904  002  RC6   25   0  n/a   6  06 FD 
7                12856  250  RC6   24   0  n/a   7  07 FD 
8                35384  082  RC6   23   0  n/a   8  08 FD 
9                33336  074  RC6   22   0  n/a   9  09 FD 
PREV CH          39480  098  RC6   21   0  n/a  10  0A FD 
POWER            27192  050  RC6   19   0  n/a  12  0C FD 
MUTE             25144  042  RC6   18   0  n/a  13  0D FD 
INFO             29240  058  RC6   16   0  n/a  15  0F FD 
VOL +            51768  146  RC6   15   0  n/a  16  10 FD 
VOL -            49720  138  RC6   14   0  n/a  17  11 FD 
BRIGHT +         55864  162  RC6   13   0  n/a  18  12 FD 
BRIGHT -         53816  154  RC6   12   0  n/a  19  13 FD 
COLOR +          43576  114  RC6   11   0  n/a  20  14 FD 
COLOR -          41528  106  RC6   10   0  n/a  21  15 FD 
CH +             19256  019  RC6   63   0  n/a  32  20 FD 
CH -             17208  011  RC6   62   0  n/a  33  21 FD 
SOURCE           02872  211  RC6   39   0  n/a  56  38 FD 
OPTION           18488  016  RC6   31  64  n/a  64  40 FD 
CC               14392  000  RC6   25  64  n/a  70  46 FD 
MENU             43064  112  RC6   11  64  n/a  84  54 FD 
up arrow         02104  208  RC6    7  64  n/a  88  58 FD 
down arrow       00056  200  RC6    6  64  n/a  89  59 FD 
left arrow       06200  224  RC6    5  64  n/a  90  5A FD 
right arrow      04152  216  RC6    4  64  n/a  91  5B FD 
OK               59448  176  RC6    3  64  n/a  92  5C FD 
red/demo         24888  041  RC6   50  64  n/a 109  6D FD  Function button for menus-also demo mode
green            31032  065  RC6   49  64  n/a 110  6E FD  Function button for menus
yellow           28984  057  RC6   48  64  n/a 111  6F FD  Function button for menus
blue             51512  145  RC6   47  64  n/a 112  70 FD  Function button for menus
active control   46648  126  RC6   73   0  n/a 150  96 FD  Continuous auto picture adjustment-basically sucks
guide            25656  044  RC6   83  64  n/a 204  CC FD 
period           64568  196  RC6   70  64  n/a 217  D9 FD  Decimal for ATSC channels
format           40248  101  RC6  106  64  n/a 245  F5 FD  picture format: wide, 4x3, zoom etc
contrast -       03384  213  RC6  100  64  n/a 251  FB FD 
contrast +       58680  173  RC6   99  64  n/a 252  FC FD 
discrete off     62157  186  RC5    0  61    0  31  1F 08 
discrete on      62149  186  RC5    0  63    0  31  1F 00 
av1              59945  178  RC5    3   4  n/a  28  1C EC  input discrete
av2              62173  186  RC5    0  57    0  31  1F 18 
av3              60121  178  RC5    3  56  n/a  28  1C 1C 
hdmi1            60125  178  RC5    3  57    0  28  1C 18  input discrete
hdmi2            59605  176  RC5    3 123    0  92  5C 10 
hdmi3            59937  178  RC5    3   6  n/a  28  1C E4 
side             60113  178  RC5    3  58  n/a  28  1C 14  input discrete
format auto      60109  178  RC5    3  61    0  28  1C 08  No other picture format discretes?
tuner            59417  176  RC5    3  72  n/a  92  5C DC  input discrete


Last edited by mdavej on Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:48 am; edited 1 time in total
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3FG
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bev,

The 6131 is a fairly old remote and PID 0184 in that remote is a RC6 executor. It is only used for setup codes Cable 0305 and 0317. In newer remotes PID 0184 (variant 2) is a RC5/RC6 Combo executor with considerably more flexibility. RemoteMaster uses the file Protocols.ini to keep information about executors, and for one reason or another, it doesn't have info about PID 0184 variant 1. That may because the 6131 also has a different RC6 executor which is PID 0058. That is supported.

You have several options. One is to ignore the message about alternate PIDs, and use the upgrade. Setup codes Cable 0305 and 0317 won't work, but I doubt you're using those. The downside of this is you'd be adding an executor that isn't needed, taking up 140 bytes of memory. It isn't needed because the upgrade actually only uses the RC6 protocol and only device 0. So a simple RC6 executor (like 0058) will work, and it is already resident in your remote.

I would do the following: Open RMIR and set it up for the 6131 (File\Remote\New Image), and on the devices tab select RC6 protocol. Open an instance of RM (I find it easier to open RemoteMaster rather than RMIR here), and load the Philips upgrade into it. Then doing one column at a time, highlight and copy the function names column and then the "6 OBC" column (not the EFCs or Hex data) into the RMIR instance.

Now you can save this as an RMDU file, and the whole remote setup as a RMIR file.
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mathdon
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The "alternate PID" option is very new to RM/RMIR, and has been added to deal precisely with this situation, an upgrade using a PID that is already in the remote for a different protocol (normally an earlier version of the same one). When you get the message, you should also get a field labelled "Alternate PID" into which you can enter whatever PID value you like. I suggest choosing a high one such as 01A0 to avoid further conflicts. You don't lose anything from the upgrade, it will just use this PID internally instead of the one in the upgrade.
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

3FG wrote:
You have several options. One is to ignore the message about alternate PIDs, and use the upgrade. Setup codes Cable 0305 and 0317 won't work, but I doubt you're using those.

Actually, that's not true because built-in setup codes only use built-in executors, they don't reach out to the EEPROM to check for upgrades.
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Rob
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mdavej wrote:
Forgive the terrible formatting. I can't seem to fix it.

I fixed it.
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for all the information... will tackle it and see if I can get a working load.

>> old remote <<

just like me ;-)

What is the jp1 remote of choice at the moment?

I have the URC-6131 (3) and a URC-8820 and a URC-8910 and they all probably qualify as obsolete

Thanks again for all the responses,
Beverly Howard
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bevhoward wrote:
What is the jp1 remote of choice at the moment?

I have the URC-6131 (3) and a URC-8820 and a URC-8910 and they all probably qualify as obsolete

The beauty of a JP1 remote is that it never becomes obsolete because you can keep adding new codes to it to make it control all of your devices. So, bottom line, there's no need to throw these remotes out just because they're old. I still use my 1999 vintage 15-1994 every day, and I've even bought spares just in case it ever breaks.

As for the current JP1 remotes, unfortunately UEI and/or OFA seem to have fallen asleep at the wheel as they're just not making that many new retail remotes, most new JP1 remotes seem to be cable remotes these days.
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 245

PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:46 am    Post subject: Update and Questions Reply with quote

An update in case it might be of interest plus a question.

Ignoring the "alternate pid" warning within the current RM beta seems to work. Initial device uploads to the remote seem to be working with no problems.

However, stumped by a problem;

1 - When I first installed RM, I was able to assign and reassign buttons by double clicking them and picking a function. This has stopped working after several uses and I wonder what changed?

Thanks in advance,
Beverly Howard
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mdavej
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are several ways to assign functions to buttons in RM. Hovering over a function will also show a tool tip. Any of the following should work on the Buttons tab and Layout tab:

- Highlight a function cell or button on the left, then double-click a function on the right to assign.

- Drag from the right to the table or button on the left.

- R-click function cell or button and pick function from list.

- Click auto-assign to assign several at once to their default buttons.


Last edited by mdavej on Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:27 pm; edited 1 time in total
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks... that helped, so, I can continue to reassign.

Strange that the doubleclick stopped working though.

Thanks again,
Beverly Howard
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mdavej
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you saying if you click a cell in the Function column (not the button column) and then double-click a function in the grid to the right it still doesn't work?
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bevhoward



Joined: 24 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>> Are you saying if you click a cell in the Function column (not the button column) and then double-click a function in the grid to the right it still doesn't work? <<

No... your previous post got me back to a working understanding.

Dragging works and highlighting a function cell and double clicking the button list to the right both work.

I also finally just discovered that the confuser was that it is possible (in the current beta) to double click a cell in the function column and get a popup list of functions to select.

I was (incorrectly) remembering that I had gotten that list double clicking a selection list of functions to the right.

The mud thins a bit more ;-)

Thanks,
Beverly Howard
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mathdon
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please see this post, and the few that precede it, for more info about the Alternate PID field, which seems in this thread to be being treated as something best ignored.
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bevhoward



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>> Please see this post, and the few that precede it, for more info about the Alternate PID field, which seems in this thread to be being treated as something best ignored. <<

While it seems to be a significant issue, it is difficult to understand what is going on, even after reading the referenced thread.

I tried your suggestion of using 01A0 as an alternate pid, but the message still remains, so, it is not clear what entering it does and if it makes any difference.

Beverly Howard
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