 |
JP1 Remotes
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ylaviolette
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 134
|
 Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:15 am Post subject: Help needed to finalize upgrade on JVC RX-5032V |
 |
|
Hi there, I would need some help with the following:
I did some work in order to build an upgrade for a JVC RX-5032V receiver (The remote itself is model RM-SRX5030J)
The device uses three different protocols (JVC,JVC175,JVC48) for which I so far created 3 individual RM upgrades; I guess I'll be able to use the device combiner to build a single upgrade (correct me if I'm wrong)
However under Protocol JVC48, I get very flaky signal probably due to a parasite "gap" signal, Can you have a look at the IR file and tell me if there's a way to adjust my RM upgrade in order to match the gap signal and hopefully correct the situation.
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=7353
I'll be glad to upgrade the final upgrade afterwards,
Thank you! |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
gfb107
Expert
Joined: 03 Aug 2003
Posts: 3411
Location: Cary, NC
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:58 am Post subject: Re: Help needed to finalize upgrade on JVC RX-5032V |
|
|
| ylaviolette wrote: | | Can you have a look at the IR file and tell me if there's a way to adjust my RM upgrade in order to match the gap signal and hopefully correct the situation. |
If you want to know about adjusting your RM upgrade, wouldn't it make sense to post your .rmdu file?
_________________
-- Greg
Original RemoteMaster developer
JP1 How-To's and Software Tools
The #1 Code Search FAQ and it's answer (PLEASE READ FIRST) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mdavej
Expert
Joined: 08 Oct 2003
Posts: 4501
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2009 9:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
| HERE's a great example of a JVC with all those protocols combined. I think you'll find the codes for front and back levels match your learns exactly. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ylaviolette
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 134
|
| Posted: Tue Oct 13, 2009 5:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thanks, here's the .rmdu file.
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=7364
As I said earlier, my upgrade works but every signal under JVC-48 is rather flaky compared to the other ones. Also, the only buttons to have extra "gap' signals when learned under IR are the same JVC-48 buttons.
Anyways, not a big deal but I'm pretty sure there is some signal fine tuning to be done in order to match the original protocol.
Thx again |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ylaviolette
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 134
|
| Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2009 2:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hi Greg did you have a chance to look into the .rmdu file ?
Any way to translate that "gap" signal? Thx |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ylaviolette
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 134
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:32 am Post subject: |
|
|
| anyone? thx |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnsfine
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 30, 2009 10:22 am Post subject: Re: Help needed to finalize upgrade on JVC RX-5032V |
|
|
| ylaviolette wrote: | | However under Protocol JVC48, I get very flaky signal probably due to a parasite "gap" signal, Can you have a look at the IR file and tell me if there's a way to adjust my RM upgrade in order to match the gap signal and hopefully correct the situation. |
The original learns are flawed. The gap decodes in the original learns are the result of those being bad learns. The gap decodes do not represent anything that belongs in the signal. The JVC-48 decodes are correct and complete. A JVC-48 signal should be all you need.
So what symptoms of what signals are you describing by "I get very flaky signal"?
The learned signals might be flaky because they are bad learns.
When you tested the upgrade, did you remove the learned signals, so you would be really testing the upgrade not accidentally testing the learned signals? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ylaviolette
Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 134
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 3:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Thx for the reply, when I say "flaky" signal I mean that when you keep a button pressed, for instance "front right level +", the original remote or a learned signal will generate a smooth/constant reaction from the amplifier IE: about +1 every second. If I use the JVC-48 generated signal, the amplifier will react randomly, going +1 then 1 second, +1, .5 second, +1 , 1.5 second, etc, etc... And yes the learned signals were removed prior to testing and I am 100% sure that the learns are flawless because the amplifier reacts to them exactly as the original remote. In fact, if you look at the gap signals for any JVC-48 button, they are not randomly generated, they are exactly the same no matter how many times/ways I relearn them. To prove my theory I looked at the signals through my USB-UIRT IR receiver:
- The signal for "Center +" (JVC-163) is identical on both the original remote and the protocol generated signal (2102144112C4 at a rate of 20 repeats/sec)
- The signal for "Front R+" (JVC-48) on the original remote is 6146504400c4 at a rate of about 11repeats/sec) and the protocol generated one is 6319141100f1 at a rate of about 8 repeats/sec.
To summarize, does the JVC-48 protocol works? Yes.
Is there something wrong with it? Yes
Is it related to only certain JVC hardware/remotes? I don't know.
If anyone technical with good IR knowledge can have a look at the files I provided, I am pretty sure something needs to be fixed in regards to the frequency of the signal to get rid of the gap signal and correctly match the original signal.
Keep me posted. Thx |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnsfine
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 4:20 pm Post subject: |
|
|
My hardware for CaptureIr is broken at the moment and I don't have time to chase this.
If any of the other experts here has an 8910 and working IrScope or CaptureIr or similar hardware and you think there is any chance Ylaviolette might be correct about the thing I disagree with below, can you capture the Vol- and Vol+ learned signals from the posted .ir file
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=7353
| ylaviolette wrote: | | If I use the JVC-48 generated signal, the amplifier will react randomly, going +1 then 1 second, +1, .5 second, +1 , 1.5 second, |
I believe that.
I took a closer look. I see the lead-in is probably missing from every frame other than the first.
Did someone recently mention something about that for JVC-48? I half remember it, but I'm not sure.
If the lead-in supposed to be only on the first frame but we generate it on every frame, that could result in strange timing for the vol ramp.
I expect some of the other experts remember how to remove the lead-in from frames other than the first.
But the learned signals are not good enough to positively confirm that the lead-in acts that way. It is a guess from the claim that something is definitely wrong combined with what the learned signals suggest.
| Quote: | | I am 100% sure that the learns are flawless because the amplifier reacts to them exactly as the original remote. |
I don't believe you.
IR.exe thinks those learned signals don't even have a repeat part, just an extra long non repeat part.
Anyone with an IR capture device: Can you tell us whether those two learned signals even repeat.
| Quote: | | In fact, if you look at the gap signals for any JVC-48 button, they are not randomly generated, they are exactly the same no matter how many times/ways I relearn them. |
Non random does not mean correct.
| Quote: | | If anyone technical with good IR knowledge can have a look at the files I provided, I am pretty sure something needs to be fixed in regards to the frequency of the signal to get rid of the gap signal and correctly match the original signal. |
I don't think that is a good way to get another expert to help you.
I'd be happy to see another expert help you, because something strange in the repeat lead-in in JVC-48 is something we as a group ought to understand and I don't really have time for the required homework. But you should respect the fact that even if I'm wrong about some important detail of these learned signals, I am not wrong about basics such as the modulation frequency or the meaning of a gap decode. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vickyg2003
Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 7073
Location: Florida
|
| Posted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 10:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: | | when I say "flaky" signal I mean that when you keep a button pressed, for instance "front right level +", the original remote or a learned signal will generate a smooth/constant reaction from the amplifier IE: about |
I am not seeing any repeat on the learned signal. Its just going out once. So I doubt that the front "right level +" will ever give you anything more than a single step. That is, it will not repeat. ylaviolette, you need to press and hold the key being learned. You can't let up on the key until your 8910 does the double flash.
John, if you look at the timing summary, you'll see that the "extra portion" is always the same length. I'm not familiar enough with UEI's learning procedure to know if this is an "incorrect learn" or some new kind of jvc signal, but it does concern me that the extra portion is consistantly the same number of timing pairs.
As John pointed out, the 'extra portion' is missing the lead in lead outs, so I beleive we need to get rid of the lead-in lead-out on the second portion. But I'd really like to see the learned signal, done with a proper a long press of the OEM remote to make sure what the repeats are supposed to look like. If we need to tweak the protocol it would be best to know what it needs to look like up front.
_________________
Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vickyg2003
Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 7073
Location: Florida
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 7:53 am Post subject: |
|
|
According to IRP notation the JVC-48
IRP notation: {37k,432}<1,-1,1,-3>(8,-4,3:8,1:8,D:8,S:8,F:8,(D^S^F):8,1,-173)+
The Extra Portion that comes after the first frame of the JVC-48 learned signals is only showing
(3:8,1:8,D:8,S:8,F:2), so I would really like to see learns recaptured using the procedure outlined here.. I'm pretty sure the learns are bad, but I am concerned at how consistant the bad learns are.
_________________
Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
johnsfine
Site Admin
Joined: 10 Aug 2003
Posts: 4766
Location: Bedford, MA
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| vickyg2003 wrote: | | I am not seeing any repeat on the learned signal. Its just going out once. So I doubt that the front "right level +" will ever give you anything more than a single step. That is, it will not repeat. |
Thanks. That is what I expected, but since I missed a detail the first time I looked, I wanted some confirmation.
| Quote: | | ylaviolette, you need to press and hold the key being learned. You can't let up on the key until your 8910 does the double flash. |
I don't think that will help.
| Quote: | | I'm not familiar enough with UEI's learning procedure |
I'm pretty familiar with it, so I think it cannot learn this signal correctly. I think retrying won't help, no matter how good the learning technique. Ylaviolette, I'm not sure of this so if you feel like trying Vicky's advice, you might prove me wrong.
| Quote: | | if this is an "incorrect learn" or some new kind of jvc signal |
My current estimate is that it is both of those.
| Quote: | | but it does concern me that the extra portion is consistantly the same number of timing pairs. |
I see no reason to be concerned about that.
| Quote: | | As John pointed out, the 'extra portion' is missing the lead in lead outs, |
I never said it was missing the lead-out. I don't believe it would be. Because it is a bad learn, we have no way to know what the lead-out looks like, so my best guess is the lead-out is ordinary. The extra part is missing the lead-in and my best guess is that is a consequence of the signal, not of the learning error.
| Quote: | | If we need to tweak the protocol it would be best to know what it needs to look like up front. |
It would be nice to know. But I think we could manage with a guess. If you want to know, you would need to capture the original signal with a better device than a learning remote. CaptureIr or IrScope would be great. But I think it is easier to go with a guess. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ElizabethD
Advanced Member
Joined: 09 Feb 2004
Posts: 2348
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 5:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
In the quoted learned signals file is one button, learned on ch+, which is different main device, namely 175. The other buttons are device 34, subdevice 84.
So i got curious. The OBC codes I used are from the "Learned..." file you quoted earlier.
Not knowing what is supposed to be, I made two upgrades each consisting of the five buttons, but each upgrade for different fixed bytes.
Upgrades went to 8910, so the attached widget/irscope files are about what 8910 sent out while I pressed the buttons, and from a macro. There are repeats in both scenarios.
In the zip file is the IR file where I identified which upgrade to match to which irscope files and screen shots of decodes.
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload.php?action=file&file_id=7462
I don't know whether any of this is useful, but it does show that UEI puts out repeats, I think without leadin. Might be interesting to see if ylaviolette used my IR file an tried those vol+ vol- buttons which seem to be of concern here. If the signal is "flaky" it could be that the receiver can't absorb them at this speed.
I'm just guessing here and hope to learn something.
_________________
Liz
Tweeking 8910, HTPro/9811, C7-7800, 6131o, 6131n, AtlasOCAP-1056B01, RCA-RCRP05B and enjoying the ride  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vickyg2003
Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 7073
Location: Florida
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:25 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
John wrote:
But I think we could manage with a guess. If you want to know, you would need to capture the original signal with a better device than a learning remote. CaptureIr or IrScope would be great. But I think it is easier to go with a guess. |
I wasn't quite sure what our guess was supposed to be. So I guessed that we just needed to change the lead-in style to be first frame only, and then shorten the leadout time. I then learned the signal to another remote and it hacked off the end, just like ylaviolette's did. I KNOW I did the learn "properly". I don't understand the learning process at all!
Now the bad news is once I send one of these signals the remote reboots.
 But I think we're on to something here.
_________________
Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vickyg2003
Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004
Posts: 7073
Location: Florida
|
| Posted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I think my problem might lie in the Device Combiner and not in my JVC48? upgrade. I'm testing on an Atlas 5 3000 and the device combiner is rebooting on ALL the device combiner keys, not just the jvc48?
Upgrade protocol 0 = 00 C9 (S3C8+) PB v4.01
45 91 51 8B 12 8F 48 08 08 00 DA 00 C6 00 DA 02
7B 3E 80 06 D0 03 54 E6 0C E8 60 03 20 01 E4 08
09 B4 03 09 20 10 F6 01 46 F6 01 0A FB 0D 00 0C
EB F4 C6 3E 00 00 B0 4A F6 01 0A AF
End
Add this protocol upgrade and see if this improves the JVC48? without hanging up your remote.
_________________
Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
File Section
Wiki
