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vickyg2003 Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004 Posts: 7073 Location: Florida |
Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:53 pm Post subject: Digital Cameras for IR Detection |
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I've often recommended using a phone to check if a signal is being sent by the original remote. I used to do that all the time. I just had to do this tonight and found my iPhone 6 doesn't show IR signals anymore. I happened to have my old iPhone 4 charged up and sure enough that digital camera shows them fine. So the phone's digital camera's may not work for testing anymore. I'd really like to know if this is a problem for all newer cell phones, or only an apple issue.
If you have a newer smart phone or newer digital camera could you report back here with a letting us know if it still does see IR signals.
EDIT:
Here are the results.
A cell phone camera is almost always the most convenient way of determining if there is an ir signal being transmitted from an ir blaster or remote. The IR typically signal shows up as a flickering white light when a signal is being sent.
We've discovered a wrinkle in that newer high end cameras are filtering out the ir signals. If you have a recent apple phone, the back camera will not register Infrared signals, but the lower quality front facing cameras still work fine for detection.
Some cameras like my Sony CX 5000 barely register the infrared signals. If I didn't know what I was looking for, I never would have seen it.
So make sure to check the front facing camera of your phone before you declare a remote or ir blaster to be dead.
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smart phones
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iphone 4 - yes
iphone 4s -yes
iphone 5 - back NO front YES
iphone 5c -back NO front YES
iphone 6 -back NO front YES
iphone 6s -back NO front YES
iphone SE - back NO front YES
Google Pixel - probably yes
Nexus 4 - yes
Nexus 5 - yes
Nexus 6P - yes
One Plus 3t - Yes
Samsung Galaxy 7 - Yes
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Cameras
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Canon A70 - yes
Canon A720IS - yes
Canon Eo64500D (DSLR) yes
Canon S5IS - yes
Logitech C270 (Webcam) - yes
Sony CX 5000 - Yes but very dim
Sony Xperia Z2 - Yes _________________ Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
Last edited by vickyg2003 on Sun Aug 20, 2017 2:16 pm; edited 5 times in total |
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pH7_jp1
Joined: 14 Sep 2003 Posts: 480 Location: Sterling Heights, MI |
Posted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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My Samsung Galaxy S7 still shows IR just fine. I tried my wife's iPhone SE and you are right, it's a no-show. |
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Barf Expert
Joined: 24 Oct 2008 Posts: 1414 Location: Munich, Germany |
Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 3:16 am Post subject: |
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Abstractly speaking, a camera should depict the picture as close a possible to the way the human eye sees it. So, a camera not responsible to IR is the better camera. My guess is that less and less "high-end" cameras will be responsible to IR.
Responsible to IR:
* Sony Xperia Z2,
* Canon EOS450D (DSLR)
* Logitech C270 (Webcam) |
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MaskedMan Tivo Expert
Joined: 10 Feb 2004 Posts: 1006 Location: Boone, IA |
Posted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 4:42 am Post subject: |
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My One Plus 3t cell phone still shows IR beam. _________________ Edmund |
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vickyg2003 Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004 Posts: 7073 Location: Florida |
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:32 am Post subject: |
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Thanks Phil, Bengt and Edmund.
Its disappointing that there are so few responses after so many views when its such an easy test to perform. Hopefully it is just that they all have one of the smart phone models listed
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smart phones
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iphone 4 - yes
iphone 4s -yes
iphone 5 - unknown
iphone 5c -unknown
iphone 6 -NO
iphone 6s - unknown
iphone SE - NO
One Plus 3t - Yes
Samsung Galaxy 7 - Yes
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Cameras
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Canon Eo64500D (DSLR) yes
Logitech C270 (Webcam) yes
Sony CX 5000 - Yes but very dim
Sony Xperia Z2, Yes _________________ Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
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yaworski
Joined: 22 Jun 2014 Posts: 454 Location: Warsaw, Poland |
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:51 am Post subject: |
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The CCD and CMOS chips are very sensitive to (near) IR light. Because of that all digital cameras are equipped with IR cut-off filters in their optics. Some filters are better than others making the IR from the remote's blaster not being visible by the chip.
Most Canon point-and-shoot cameras are sensitive to IR. I've had few models (A70, A720IS, S5IS) and they all "see" IR signals.
All Nexus phones I've had (Nexus 4, Nexus 5, Nexus 6P now) have IR sensitive cameras. I think Nexus 5X also should be sensitive as it uses the same camera module as 6P. I think both Google Pixel phones from last year also use the same or very similar camera module. _________________ Marcin |
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vickyg2003 Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004 Posts: 7073 Location: Florida |
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the information Marcin. I've updated the first post with the models you provided. _________________ Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
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gfb107 Expert
Joined: 03 Aug 2003 Posts: 3411 Location: Cary, NC |
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bobshults
Joined: 07 May 2005 Posts: 11
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Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:54 pm Post subject: |
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iphone 6: Rear camera: no. Front Facetime camera: yes
ipod Touch 4th gen: Rear camera: no. Front Facetime camera: yes
Ipad 9.7in (2017): Rear camera: no. Front Facetime camera: yes |
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vickyg2003 Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004 Posts: 7073 Location: Florida |
Posted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Greg.
Bob THANK YOU!! I never thought of using the front camera.!!!! That works great. _________________ Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
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zaphod7501
Joined: 02 Aug 2004 Posts: 533 Location: Peoria Illinois |
Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 7:39 am Post subject: |
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iphone 5: Rear camera: no. Front Facetime camera: yes
In a Lifeproof case which could influence the detection, I suppose. _________________ Just call me Zaphod (or Steve) --- I never should have started using numbers in a screen name but I just can't stop now. |
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gfb107 Expert
Joined: 03 Aug 2003 Posts: 3411 Location: Cary, NC |
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unclemiltie Expert
Joined: 21 Jan 2004 Posts: 1795 Location: Pittsburgh, PA |
Posted: Fri Aug 25, 2017 9:57 am Post subject: |
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Barf wrote: | Abstractly speaking, a camera should depict the picture as close a possible to the way the human eye sees it. So, a camera not responsible to IR is the better camera. My guess is that less and less "high-end" cameras will be responsible to IR.
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Correct!. the CMOS and CCD image sensors used in almost every digital camera ever made are very sensitive to IR. So much so that every camera has an IR filter put on in front of the sensor to take the IR out because the signal will overwhelm the visible signal. Often this is an IR filter coated onto one of the lens elements.
The more expensive cameras have better IR filters and thus the signal that actually reaches the sensor is "more true" to the visible light than the cheaper ones. But as a result they are less sensitive to IR frequencies. _________________ this JP1 stuff is a sickness! |
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HamburgerHelper1
Joined: 22 Feb 2014 Posts: 570
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Posted: Sat Aug 26, 2017 6:58 pm Post subject: ir detection |
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If your camera won't do the trick for testing ir output
You can try pointing your remote at a night light
I tested this today A dark room with photo sensor night light
I had to be about an inch from the sensor but push remote buttons
and the night light flickers to the pulse of the Ir
Just giving you another option for testing if Ir is outputting |
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vickyg2003 Site Admin
Joined: 20 Mar 2004 Posts: 7073 Location: Florida |
Posted: Sun Aug 27, 2017 8:49 am Post subject: |
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unclemiltie wrote: | Barf wrote: | Abstractly speaking, a camera should depict the picture as close a possible to the way the human eye sees it. So, a camera not responsible to IR is the better camera. My guess is that less and less "high-end" cameras will be responsible to IR.
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Correct!. the CMOS and CCD image sensors used in almost every digital camera ever made are very sensitive to IR. So much so that every camera has an IR filter put on in front of the sensor to take the IR out because the signal will overwhelm the visible signal. Often this is an IR filter coated onto one of the lens elements.
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With an occupation of "mobile phone camera modules" we will definitely defer to you on this. Thanks for your input Bill.
HambergerHelper1 wrote: | You can try pointing your remote at a night light |
It took me a while to locate my night light with the light sensor and find a working light bulb to fit it, and find an outlet in a dark room, but I see that it does show you that the IR is sending signals. Not nearly as convenient as looking at it in the hand held phone in any light. Thanks for the idea. Its just one more way to test in a home where a user has light sensitive night lights and no cell phone. That really does apply to lots of my elderly friends. _________________ Remember to provide feedback to let us know how the problem was solved and share your upgrades.
Tip: When creating an upgrade, always include ALL functions from the oem remote, even if you never plan on assigning them to a button. Complete function lists makes an upgrade more helpful to others.
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