Problem with LKP using 15-1994 Ext-5

[dmhines]

After having success with EXT-3 on my 15-2116 I decided to try EXT-5 on my 15-1994. I used the same basic design as my 2116 but ran into a couple of problems. The first problem was that my TV power wouldn't work. I fixed that my adding the JVC 0034 Long Duration protocol from the file section (thanks a million to whoever made that protocol).

The next problem (and the one I can't resolve) is with the VCR LKP. I have each device button set up to perform normal device selection on a short press and on the long press side all necessary devices are powered up and the necessary inputs, DSP mode, and key groups are set. This is working for all but the VCR device button.

The short press of VCR works but when I execute the long press the only thing that happens is the LED blinks for a few seconds. It's as though the macro is being executed but none of the commands are being taken by any of my devices.

I've poured over the program for hours and I just can't find anything wrong with it. If you folks wouldn't mind, could you take a look at it and see if you can spot anything that might be causing this problem?

I've uploaded the IR file here http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... le_id=2264


Thanks,
Doug

[Capn Trips]

Well, you've got me flummoxed!

My inspection of your IR file concludes that the VCR macro/LKP SHOULD work. So I guess you need a REAL expert to take a look and comment.

As an aside, I see lots of opportunity to SIMPLIFY and save memory in your IR setup(example, you repeat the same LKP for each device's power button. You could do this globally with a SINGLE LKP and a macro calling that LKP) , but (1) you are nowhere NEAR maxing out your memory, and (2) "if it works, don't fix it", and this has nothing to do with your immediate problem.

Regardless, I see no reason why your VCR LKP should not be working.

[ElizabethD]

Well, you've got me flummoxed!
...
Regardless, I see no reason why your VCR LKP should not be working.

He got you what?? (re:flummoxed!)

VCR issue:
Long shot, but worth a try: in IR, hit edit on 0034 protocol, then in the little text box change 4th byte from the end to some value larger than 2. That refers to number of repeats. 3-5, even 8, works my JVC DVD keys used in macros.

3D 92 11 8B 14 85 59 08 08 01 06 00 F2 01 06 02
FF 2E 24 10 68 08 20 FF 02 8D 01 33

If this fails, you will need an EXPERT as Capn said.

For some reason the color won't work and bold didn't either
It's not red in IR.

[Capn Trips]

It seems that the issue is NOT duration of VCR signals, it's the sending/recognition of all of the other device signals in the sequence as well, and they would not be affected by the VCR device's duration.

By the way:

Word of the Day for Tuesday July 19, 2005
flummox \FLUM-uhks\, transitive verb:
To confuse; to perplex.

And when a poll's results happen to upset the conventional wisdom, or confound the experts, or flummox the pundits, then that's a poll to remember.
--Michael Kagay, "Unexpected Results Make for Memorable Polls," New York Times, March 23, 2000

The chronological order of the Stuart, Hanover, Lancaster and Tudor British royal houses had me flummoxed.
--Sara Ivry, "Game Show Wannabe: I Coulda Been a Millionaire," New York Times, February 27, 2000

Flummoxed by the surreality of history and the mind-boggling changes unleashed by the 60's, many writers in that era became minimalists, withdrawing, turtlelike, inside their own homes and heads.
--Michiko Kakutani, "New Wave of Writers Reinvents Literature," New York Times, April 22, 2000

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The origin of flummox is unknown.

Synonyms: puzzle, baffle, bewilder, dumbfound, confound, perplex. Find more at Thesaurus.com.

Usage: Flummox is considered informal; its use should be restricted to speech and casual writing.

Hey, if this isn't casual usage, I don't know what is

[underquark]

For some reason the color won't work and bold didn't either

That's because the software that runs this forum (and many others) is set so that Code appears as a different (more monospace and "codey") font. It is already bold and is already green and its appearance is determined by the line "<span class="genmed"><b>Code:<..." etc. in the html that goes to make up the web page you see.

[dmhines]

Well, you've got me flummoxed!

Me too!


Thanks to all who have looked into this for me. It's sure got me stumped as well. When I get home from work tonight I'm gonna keep digging into it and see if I can figure it out. Maybe its something as simple as putting a new set of batteries in the remote.

[ElizabethD]

I think Jon Armstrong made this protocol, if not, he blessed it.

I took another look at the IR file. 4 JVC devices?
Capn, I missed that nothing works, based on this:

The next problem (and the one I can't resolve) is with the VCR LKP... This is working for all but the VCR device button.

The short press of VCR works but when I execute the long press the only thing that happens is the LED blinks for a few seconds. It's as though the macro is being executed but none of the commands are being taken by any of my devices.

Ok, so instead of looking at the common JVC protocol, perhaps the issue is unknown key sets. As I look at the VCR macro, phantom3 LKP side and xshift-Phantom1 use buttons from keysets for numbers or power that may not have yet been set for TV and others.
Try a test: I wonder what would happen if few commands from the long side of LKP was put into the macro where phantom3 now is up to the 14-15 limit. If it won't work in-line it won't work any better in the LKP.

I do not have 1994, Capn does as you can see in the beer note .
In 7800 (no nested macros, no temporary device) in initial setup-type macro I do have to say something like M_RCV;SHIFT-1;2L;M_VCR;SHIFT-1 (shift-1=discreteON) and so on, because I can't count on those keysets being known right up front for every device taking part in the setup. Considering that for dmhines it works (??) all other devices, this theory can't be right. But if things don't work, I thought I'll toss this idea on the table and learn from the discussion that'll likely follow, unless it's the batteries.

Capn, thanks for the English lesson
Underquark - it can't nest properties, eh?

[dmhines]

I took another look at the IR file. 4 JVC devices?

Actually there's 3. One of those TV upgrades is necessary because of a single function that uses a different device # than all the rest. That's one that threw me for a loop a few months ago. You can read about that here: http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewt ... highlight=

I wonder what would happen if few commands from the long side of LKP was put into the macro where phantom3 now is up to the 14-15 limit. If it won't work in-line it won't work any better in the LKP.

Good idea. In the VCR macro I took out phantom3 and inserted the discrete on commands for my TV, sat rcvr, & audio rcvr. It worked perfectly. All devices powered up and the remote was left with all the key groups associated with the VCR. So, I guess the problem is with the LKP.

This is getting more strange by the minute. I’ve tested everything on the remote and at this point absolutely everything works except that darn LKP on the VCR. However, I have discovered a couple of new things:

1. Since the LKP on each device button is supposed to turn on the devices, set inputs, and all that, I had been testing this with all devices off. When executed in that manner, nothing happens except for the blinking LED. Not a single device powers up. However, if I launch the VCR LKP with my TV, SAT, and RCVR (AUX1) already on, I can see that some commands are being taken but – I’m not sure how to put this – there is some very strange behavior going on. Obviously, none of the discrete on commands work. The AUX1 command to set the input to VCR (the 3 key) instead sets the input to SAT which is the #1 key. The AUX1 cmd (key 7) for DSP mode works. The TV discrete input function (tv/video) works. Then it gets even weirder – my SAT rcvr channel is changed to 0, or 5, or 50! Where the heck do those numbers come from! Most of the time it gets set to channel 0 but on occasion the 5 pops up in there.

2. My remote (15-1994) has started acting strange when hooked up to the interface. Whenever the cable is plugged into the remote, none of the buttons make the LED blink. The keypad seems to be locked or something. I can’t even start the extender w/o unplugging the cable because the power button doesn’t do anything if the cable is plugged in. I also no longer get the double blink after doing an upload. I’ve checked the interface using my 15-2116 and it is problem free.

I tried a new set of batteries and that didn’t help. At this point I’m at a loss. The only thing that makes any sense to me is that maybe I’m having a hardware failure on the remote itself.

[ElizabethD]

You've got me flummoxed too

Capn is right. You need and EXPERT for this. I have no clue any more other than few conclusions.
Assuming 1994 is not broken, couple things by way of summary for the EXPERTS to help:

1. Since keysets have nothing to do with it (I'll never get this straight. Good you didn't take that path but you knew better, considering your other post here about Set and Dev). Since the same key sequence works in the VCR macro, one would think LKP is to be implicated, but then why does it work for other devices?

2. I don't know whether you tried different number of repeats in the JVC protocol. But here, too, it makes no sense to work in a macro but not LKP, so is likely irrelevant.

3. Try to swap two sides of LKP as a test. I wonder if the long sequence might work on the short side, which again might implicate a LKP and that seems to make no sense any more.

4. No blinks after an upload doesn't sound good. But I've seen spooky behavior like this too (wrong functions sent on wrong keys), and I conceeded finally that it was my code, probably over time destroying the extender code, because after a full and complete factory reset one of my remotes was no longer broken. Your various trials and experiments might have done that as well. So save your IR file, try a good reset, then upload to remote. Download back to IR, save under a different name and compare the files, in DOS or Excel. If no match, then a flaky remote might be an issue.
Reset instructions are here:
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4057

[dmhines]

I'm afraid I'm gonna have to throw in the towel on this one. I'm convinced that their must be something wrong with extender-5.

My remote works just fine un-extended. It even works with extender-5 so long as I don't have all my devices loaded at the same time. I've started from scratch and loaded each device one by one to see if I can tell what breaks it. I haven't narrowed it down to anything specific but what I have learned is that the VCR LKP works if the VCR is the only thing loaded into the remote. Once I start loading other devices things get weird. At the moment I have my TV, SAT, AMP, and VCR configured and the LKP won't run at all - no blinking LED, no noth'n. At least the LED used blink.

So, anyway, I've spent WAY too many hours on this so unless someone comes up with a good suggestion I'm afraid I'm giving up - my family misses me

[The Robman]

Hopefully either John Fine or Hal Takahar will spot this thread and offer some advice. I'm not an extender expert, so I can't help.

If you think ext5 is faulty, have you tried any of the earlier versions of the 15-1994 extender?

[dmhines]

If you think ext5 is faulty, have you tried any of the earlier versions of the 15-1994 extender?

No, because I don't think the other extenders support the use of LKP functions. If I'm wrong about that I will try the others.

[Capn Trips]

Been away for a while. It's a shame you're not making progress on this.. Could you upload the latest version you have with a complete description of what you're doing and of what works and does not work? It's a little confusing to piece it together at this point.

Extender 5 has worked for me previously (my current setup is not on my 1994, but I still have it) including LKPs and nested macros and on and on. I would suggest simplifying everything you have and avoiding the use of phantoms to facilitate testing and troubleshooting.

Also you have not indicated whether you ever did a complete factory reset before you started uploading from scratch - that may make the difference.

As for the JVC device issue forcing you to use extra device upgrades mentioned earlier, have you looked at this JVC custom combo upgrade? It was created for me by the late, great Jon Armstrong (here's his basic upgrade) and works quite well combining several JVC device numbers in a single protocol.

[dmhines]

I just wanted to let all of you know that I'm not ignoring your posts, I'm just not able to work on this right now. I'll try to get back to it soon and I'll let you know if I make any progress.

Thanks again for all your help.