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Difference between URC-7980 (EU) and URC-7880 (US)?

 
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StefanR



Joined: 07 Feb 2021
Posts: 23
Location: Germany

                    
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:53 am    Post subject: Difference between URC-7980 (EU) and URC-7880 (US)? Reply with quote

Hello,

just a short question, what is the difference between the EU and US version?

Both remotes have the description:

60302-4160000 V03
OFA Nevo Smart Control
JUL.2015

I found no difference in the layout or the used components.

The only difference i found is the free memory when starting a config in RMIR:

URC-7980: 3923
URC-7880: 1871

Why is here a such big dfference? Is in the US version a different firmware image with more setup codes?

Kind regards
Stefan
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mathdon
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

StefanR wrote:
Why is here a such big dfference? Is in the US version a different firmware image with more setup codes?

There certainly is different firmware between the US and European versions of basically the same remote, and they tend to have completely different IR databases of setup codes and protocols. In the case of the URC-7880 and URC-7980 there is also a requirement, due to the nature of the Texas Instruments processor they use, that the data area for user setups has to be a whole number of 0x800-byte pages. The URC-7980 has two such pages, the URC-7880 has only one. But why this is the case is not clear. The actual firmware data is slightly smaller in the URC-7880 than in the URC-7980 but the URC-7880, for some unknown reason, leaves a lot of blank space at the end of the firmware before the start of the user data area.

Hope this helps, even though it doesn't really answer the question.
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Graham
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StefanR



Joined: 07 Feb 2021
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

O.k. sounds confusing. Confused Smaller Firmware uses more space.

When programming space efficient this will be enough space, but when learning it will be not enough for the main functions of one remote...

Is it possible to program the 7980 firmware into a 7880?
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The Robman
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Joined: 01 Aug 2003
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't have either remote personally, but if you open the two RDFs with Notepad or any other text editor, you'll see that:

1. They have different signatures (606101=7880, 603704=7980), so they do have different firmware.
2. They have different EEPROM area sizes (yeah, it's not really an EEPROM, it's flash memory, we just call it that because the older remotes used actual EEPROMs)
3. The 7880 appears to have a "game" mode which the 7980 does not.
4. The button maps are different
5. The built in protocols are different
6. The setup code lists are different.

I don't think it's a question of one version having MORE setup codes than the other, it's more a question of them having DIFFERENT setup codes based on their target market. There are many brands and models available in Europe that are not available in the US, and vice versa. And there are features available in one region that are not available in the other, for example, we don't use Teletext in the US, so no need to waste space with codes for that.

UEI tries to be as efficient as possible with their memory usage, so they customize the memory usage based on the needs of the target market.

However, that is all immaterial to a JP1 user because even if you have the "wrong" remote for your region, there's more than enough memory to load fresh upgrades for all of your devices, etc.

NOTE: cross-posted with the previous 2 posts, which weren't there when I wrote this.
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Rob
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Last edited by The Robman on Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:37 pm; edited 1 time in total
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StefanR



Joined: 07 Feb 2021
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Location: Germany

                    
PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was only curious to know more about the remote... I was wondering that a exact identical remote has only half the memory available...Both remotes have the "same" key layout, only some key's have a different label, i opened my broken7890 and found pictures of a open 7880, they are exactly the same.

And yes the memory is enough when working with the RMIR software, this i wrote in my last post... This is the reason for using it. But before i tryed to learn missing key's and for this the memory wasn't big enough. With the 7890 this wasn't a problem.

Sorry, i'm a beginner in that, but i think i'm learning quick. Smile

Game mode? Both remote have a "game" activity and a game device, there is no difference...

Btw. OFA removed the 7890 from the market, they told me that in the EU the people don't need 8 devces, 5 are enough... This is the reason that i'm using here the 7880....

But back to my last question, is it possible to replace the firmware? (Store it from a 7980 and put it into a 7880?)
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like I said, I don't have either remote, and I didn't even look up pictures of them, what I did was open both RDFs and compare what I saw.

I don't know whether it would be possible to extract the firmware from one remote and transfer it to the other, but I wonder what the purpose of doing that would be? Reason being that whatever benefit you think you would get from that, we could probably give you via other means.

You may have figured this out already, but for a JP1-er, the learning memory is merely a means to determine the codes for a new device in order to build a new upgrade. Learning memory is very inefficient when compared to upgrades and keymoves.
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Rob
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StefanR



Joined: 07 Feb 2021
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is no intention, i was reading/writing this here and i'm getting a thought, how about transfering the firmware to make from a 7880 a 7980... Because this seems to be the only difference...

You are right, there is at the moment no benefit from doing this, excpt perhaps learning and doing it because it is possible, if it is possible... Cool
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mathdon
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

StefanR wrote:
i was reading/writing this here and i'm getting a thought, how about transfering the firmware to make from a 7880 a 7980...

Not possible, not even with developer tools unfortunately, due to hardware write protection. But if you really have an OEM remote that you want to learn in its entirety to a 7880 then I am sure we can help you to create a device upgrade instead that will send the same signals. You would have to learn some of the signals, save as a .rmir file, then delete those and learn another batch until all are learned. Then post all the .rmir files in a zip package in the Diagnosis area so we can see what is needed.
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Graham
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StefanR



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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for that clear answer. Very Happy

And no, all is fine here, as i wrote, only mindgames. (Don't know if this is the right term for that, in german we say "Gedankenspiele" when you thinking about something if it is possible or not or how can something be done...)

I want only to know.

Currently i have all configured and working.
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The Robman
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

StefanR wrote:
And no, all is fine here, as i wrote, only mindgames. (Don't know if this is the right term for that, in german we say "Gedankenspiele" when you thinking about something if it is possible or not or how can something be done...)

And now I have a John Lennon song playing in my head! Smile
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bitshftr



Joined: 02 Jan 2022
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2022 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mathdon wrote:
But if you really have an OEM remote that you want to learn in its entirety to a 7880 then I am sure we can help you to create a device upgrade instead that will send the same signals. You would have to learn some of the signals, save as a .rmir file, then delete those and learn another batch until all are learned. Then post all the .rmir files in a zip package in the Diagnosis area so we can see what is needed.


Is there a guide for this? I am trying to learn just 3 devices onto my new 7880, and I'm out of memory.

If I'm reading you correctly, it sounds like I can learn one device (the TV, let's say), then save that as a .rmir file. I'm unclear what you mean by "then delete those". I feel like you're saying I'll end up with 3 separate .rmir files, that I can zip up and post to the Diagnosis forum...but then what happens? Someone can combine these into a single "upgrade"? And then I can somehow upload that "upgrade" to a factory-reset 7880, and it will fit in memory, whereas the memory can't hold all of my learned buttons for the 3 devices? Do "upgrades" not live in the same memory space as learned buttons?

Sorry for all the questions. I'm fairly technically oriented, but I'm new to JP1.
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mathdon
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 22, 2022 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bitshftr wrote:
If I'm reading you correctly, it sounds like I can learn one device (the TV, let's say), then save that as a .rmir file. I'm unclear what you mean by "then delete those". I feel like you're saying I'll end up with 3 separate .rmir files, that I can zip up and post to the Diagnosis forum...but then what happens? Someone can combine these into a single "upgrade"? And then I can somehow upload that "upgrade" to a factory-reset 7880, and it will fit in memory, whereas the memory can't hold all of my learned buttons for the 3 devices?

You are reading me correctly, and yes to the questions, but you can probably do the conversions yourself. Learn one device, then on the Learned Signals tab select all the signals and press the "Convert to Device Upgrade" button. If that works then you can delete the learned signals and repeat for the other two devices. If that fails then do as your quote suggests and I will look further into it for you.

Quote:
Do "upgrades" not live in the same memory space as learned buttons?

Yes, the same memory space but a device upgrade takes up less space than even one learned signal, never mind a whole deviceful of learned signals. So all your device upgrades will easily fit even if the learned signals will not.
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bitshftr



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PostPosted: Sun Jan 23, 2022 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

^ Amazing! That all worked! I now have 3 separate "upgrades", combined into one .rmir file, and the remote does everything I want it to. Thank you.
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