RMIR: Prototype IR function in RM

[ElizabethD]

203 alpha 28 build 5

(1) RMIR: I would like to get an "Are you sure" prompt or, better yet, some sort of clear wording similar to what IR uses
1a. prior to deleting anything (keymove, special, protocol, etc.)
1b. prior to Download and Upload from/to the remote. A mouse can slip over the menu to a wrong choice.
(2) RMIR: Download asks what RDF to use. What if the purpose of download is to find out what RDF it uses, or does it have an extender, or what Extender version is in a remote? Raw download told me, but only because RC remote (Atlas also) has extender version in raw data that Bill put in and my remote had a sticker with a date on it . But if it was another remote, like 7800 or 6131 or 8910/HTpro would we be able to see? Or does RMIR really have to ask?
(3) RMIR: Changing extender version: Does RMIR's "Install extender" mean the same thing that IR calls "Merge ..." or its equivalent cmd line such as "Extinstall 3A79ext-notes.hex yourirfile.ir newirfile.ir -sig=$0600" for the RCA remote? I just upgraded one RCA remote using IR because I wasn't sure what RMIR means.
(4) RM: in some remotes (7800, 6131, 8910/HTpro) there are two bytes left of the signature. Atlas and RC don't. What are those bytes? Checksums? I just can't remember.
(5) RM: Mismatch of Window title and file. To reproduce in RM (from shortcut or double click file): Load any .rmdu file. No window title. Save the file. Note that window title is now of the saved file. Load another .rmdu file. The window title shows the first file even though the stuff on the screen is from the second one (oops, what file will I be saving??). Save the second file. Now window title catches up. I would love to have the window title in RM always filled.(Do you know that there's a space between RM and IR in RMIR's window title?)
(6) RM: When, due to pasting blank cells in various columns, and due to me wanting to retain said cells, two issues arise:
6a. The Clean button will delete rows that have no hex."Are you sure?" here would be nice.
6b. If I fill with fake OBC number (zero...) then those functions are available to be assigned to buttons, making things look messy, but the're red so no panic. I wish there was a way to indicate that it's there, but don't use. No big deal, just reporting.

I better stop at 6 nits and get the latest build Nice setup for update vs the new big package.

[mathdon]

A few immediate responses:

(2) Download only asks what remote to use when there is an ambiguity. It matches signature first, and if there is more than one remote with that signature then it matches on EEPROM size and fixed data. Fixed data usually (depends on the RDF) includes extender version. With Atlas remotes in particular, this can still leave several to choose from. It offers a list of all those matching on these criteria. It can do no more.

(3) Install extender means what it says. ExtInstall (see - the same words) is built in to RMIR, it is not an add-in as with IR. It doesn't work quite the same way as IR Merge but it has the same effect. I think IR saves the merge automatially as a .ir file. RMIR installs the extender into the current setup and leaves RMIR open with the result. You can then further modify it, look at it and discard it, save it as a .rmir file or do whatever you like with it.

(4) They are the checksum. In some remotes it precedes the signature, in others it follows it.

(6a) Functions with no hex are spurious. They do nothing. Why would you want to retain them?

(6b) I have no idea why you want to put in fake OBCs, but if you do, surely it is up to you to remember that they are fake?

I will think about (1) and look into (5).

Edit: I have fixed (5) for the next build, including removing the space in RM IR. I would like other user's views on (1) as many people are irritated by too many "Confirm?" requests.

[mdavej]

My 2 cents

1.a, 6.a. Too annoying. I can always reload my original file to recover. Whatever I want to keep, I can fill with fake hex myself or not use clean.
1.b. Can't recover from an accidental upload, so this would be ok. Add some warning text like "Are you sure? You are about to overwrite the entire contents of your remote with this file", and "You are about to overwrite this file with the contents of your remote", or something to that effect.

I do appreciate Liz giving us a fresh perspective. She's brought up a lot of stuff I never considered.

[ElizabethD]

(6a) Functions with no hex are spurious. They do nothing. Why would you want to retain them?

(6b) I have no idea why you want to put in fake OBCs, but if you do, surely it is up to you to remember that they are fake?

I don't remember what I did five minutes ago
6a. Blank hex. Record keeper. I may want to try a code I find in the file section or in a post. Put it in. If it works it stays. If it fails, copy subdevice and OBC into the notes column, wipe off hex. I have a record what I already tried.
And yes, avoiding Clean button is a solution, if you remember. The file is normally saved, so it's not a huge issue.
1a. A prompt might annoy, but if a file is not yet saved, you just built something and want to get rid of another approach, it would be nice to be able to confirm.
1b. Of course chatty stuff is annoying. But it's more annoying when you're working a new setup, haven't saved it yet, want to try it first, and ooops, you just did download instead upload. Or accidentally uploaded a bad setup over a perfectly functioning remote. Perhaps an Undo button might work? Or some temp file save?
I wished there was an alert the day my mouse slided to the wrong menu item when it collided with the USB jp1.3 connector. I only have this one available USB port and it's on the same side as the mousie.
The wording mdavej wrote would be fine.

New item still in build 5
7. RMIR: Device editor > edit protocol. Here the window title falls off the screen up top.

[mathdon]

I have posted the jar file for RMIR v2.03 Alpha 28 build 7. This is intended to replace that in build 6. It will also work in any earlier build of Alpha 28 but it won't fully give you build 7.

There is now a prompt on upload. I haven't put one on download as if there is a file currently loaded in RMIR that has unsaved changes, you are already asked if you want to save the changes before proceeding. Is this OK? I can put a specific prompt if it is wanted, but I see no need for it.

There is now also a prompt on any table deletion (including cleaning the Function table). This, however, can be turned off with the new menu item "Options/Suppress Messages/All table deletes".

For Liz's item 7, the protocol editor was being centered on the RMIR window, so if this was in the upper part of the screen it could push the top of the protocol editor window off the top of the screen. It is now centered on the screen, which I hope will resolve the problem.

I have also fixed another obscure bug that Liz had failed to spot . I won't say what it was as it is now gone .

Some time ago Liz asked the meaning of the shaded entries in the Key Moves tab. I have now put in a tooltip that explains this if you hover the mouse over any shaded cell.

Please try all this and report back.

[ElizabethD]

203 alpha 28 build 7
All done. Good stuff
Thanks for explaining previous items 2-4. I now get it.
1a. Nice option for keep/suppress messages about deleting anything. Should make both sides happy.
1b. You've convinced me about no need for prompt to do download. The prompt prior to Upload works fine.
5. Window titles totally fixed. In fact, I wondered why earlier there often were none, but didn't pay attention, till this mismatch happened.
6a. Prompt for the Clean button to me is more helpful than the tooltip.
6b. The functions with no hex are no longer in the list to assign. Nice.
7. Protocol window title fixed. No longer is off the screen..

I have a problem with few long tooltips vanishing too soon, for instance reading notes about a macro or reading a long LKP sequence which doesn't fit in a column. Could they not time out until the mouse is further away?
I like the new tooltip about the shaded keymoves. Handy reminder.

[mathdon]

I have a problem with few long tooltips vanishing too soon, for instance reading notes about a macro or reading a long LKP sequence which doesn't fit in a column. Could they not time out until the mouse is further away?

Sounds simple enough, doesn't it, but you have posed me a real challenge with this one, Liz . Please try RMIR v2.03 Alpha 28 build 8. It is not as good as I would like, but I hope it meets your needs.

In build 8, tooltips on table cells should remain visible until you move to a different cell. There is still a time-out at 5 minutes, but I expect you will seldom reach it. (I could make it longer if needed.) Tooltips on other components such as buttons behave as before.

There is an oddity about what "moving to another cell" actually means. If the tooltip lies entirely within the RMIR window then it means what it says - that the mouse pointer has been moved into the area of another cell, or moved beyond the table edge, even if that cell or table edge is hidden by the tooltip of the current cell. However, if the tooltip overlaps an edge of the RMIR window then the tooltip will remain open while the pointer is within it, even if its position is above another cell or beyond the edge of the table.

This seems to be a Java peculiarity that is nothing to do with the RMIR implementation, but you may experience it so I thought it worth mentioning. Note also that in view of the tooltip I added to shaded cells in the Key Move tab, that tooltip will now be permanently displayed (on some cell or other) while the mouse pointer lies within the shaded area.

[mathdon]

There is a major issue with build 8 of RMIR v2.03 Alpha 28. It works as intended under Java 6, but under Java 7 a tooltip on the bottom row of a table, that does not overlap the edge of the RMIR window, remains open if you move the mouse pointer out of the tooltip downwards. It took a long time browsing the web to find out how to resolve this, and I now find that the fix only works for Java 6. I will look further, but may have to abandon this attempt at long-lasting tooltips if I cannot find another solution.

[ElizabethD]

Graham,
Bottom line first: The tooltip duration fix is wonderful. It took me forever to replicate what you saw, and it's so infrequent, it's no bother. Just click someplace below within or outside RMIR wondow and it goes away.

In case this matters: XP-SP3, Java 7u72, alpha 28 build 8
And, likely, I'm just paraphrasing what you said. Not sure 100%.
On macros it only persisted when the text was wrapped (not overlapping the edge of RMIR window). Not when a one liner.
On devices it got stuck only when the text was wrapped.
On FAV list not stuck at all, it's just one loooong line of text falling well outside right edge of RMIR.
The tooltip on the shaded bottom row of Keymoves did not get stuck even though it's multiliner. Curiously it persisted on Snagit screenshot after I took the capture, but went away when I moved the cursor!

New nag:
When I close RMIR without saving and get the message do you want to save, the text mentions Device Upgrade. Shouldn't it be Device configuration? Or, better: "Device RMIR configuration".

And a wish:
Would it be possible to add to the right click context menu to just copy the row, so it can be pasted into a Notepad.
Multiple rows would be handy as well.
Why? Few long LKP or macros may require me to look what some of those buttons do on other sheets as well as Device upgrade, so having a separate Notepad text would help cross-referencing when debugging.

[mdavej]

Graham,

Would it be easy to add a little more keyboard support, like Delete key for the Delete and Remove buttons, and maybe Insert for New?

[mathdon]

Here is RMIR v2.03 Alpha 28 build 9. It is an upgrade file for build 6 or later and also contains one new, and one modified, RDF. It is a zip file that should be unzipped into the folder containing the existing build.

I have handled the issue of avoiding "stuck" tooltips in a completely different way from that in build 8. This seems to work in both Java 6 and Java 7, but of course I can't test it on Linux or Mac OS X. It still is not ideal, but is the best I can do.

@Liz
You are not paraphrasing what I said. I don't understand the differing behaviour on different tabs. The tables are all built on one underlying foundation and I have added the tooltip functionality to that, so there is only one implementation of it that is shared by all the tables. My best guess is that it is erratic behaviour caused by the problems with that original implementation in Java 7. If it recurs with build 9, please post the .rmir file and tell me exactly what you were doing, so that I can try to reproduce it.

The tooltip on the shaded bottom row of Keymoves did not get stuck even though it's multiliner. Curiously it persisted on Snagit screenshot after I took the capture, but went away when I moved the cursor!

This supports the thoughts I was beginning to have, that tooltips which overlap the edge of the Java application are actually implemented as a separate application, which is why it is so difficult to interact with them. Tooltips which do not overlap the edge are, I think, implemented as labels in the underlying application itself.

Your issue with Fav/Scan list showing as one loooong line is a result of the tooltips using word wrap, so wraps only occur at a space character. There were no spaces in the Fav/Scan list, so nowhere to break. I have now added a space following each {pause} and it seems to break OK now.

I have changed the wording on the close-without-saving message.

Now for your wish to be able to select multiple rows for posting into Notepad. You can do that at present, as you can select any rectangular block of cells. I don't see any great benefit in adding a specific row-select feature when all you need do is click the top left cell of your block, hold down shift and then press the bottom right cell. I have tried posting into Notepad and Excel in this way and both seemed to work fine.

@Dave

Would it be easy to add a little more keyboard support, like Delete key for the Delete and Remove buttons, and maybe Insert for New?

This came too late for build 9. I will look into it.

Edit: It seems simple to add such keyboard support. What more would you suggest, beyond the ones you have already mentioned?

[ElizabethD]

Copy/paste works great! I didn't know about it here. Thanks.

Oh, the elusive java tooltips
Still on build 8, I repeated on 3 tabs, did few screenshots for your collection of an Atlas file. If you have nothing better to do, review my notes on the screenies. To replicate macros - just move the F2 macro to be on the bottom.
That stuff is really hard to pinpoint, I agree. And as you say it is likely on all tabs, so long as the exact conditions are met, which is rough.
RMIR file is included in .zip
http://www.hifi-remote.com/forums/dload ... e_id=13147

Oops, I just realized that I misread your post. You asked for build 9 evidence. Will do, I will now download Build 9. EDIT: Works fine in build 9

[mdavej]

Only a few more keys:

- Delete for Remove in the Macro popup
- Ctrl+D for Clone

Not a keyboard thing, but Double click Available key to Add in Macro popup. Shifted double-click to Add Shifted (if possible). If not too much trouble, double click would insert instead of add if a command on the right is highlighted. Don't spend any time on this if it's going to be complicated. Just a wish list item really.

All I can think of at the moment. Essentially whatever tends to be repetitive, like adding and deleting lots of things.

Thanks!

[ElizabethD]

Graham,
IGNORE THIS PARAGRAPH
In Build 9 something is funny about Move up and down buttons on the Special Functions tab. The screen doesn't refresh, so you end up with a duplicate. Seems like only resizing the window fixes the display. I checked keymoves, macros, devices - they are fine. Just the Special tab acts goofy.
It also looks like you can only move up or down once on this tab. Pressing it again seems to do nothing.

Wow. I love how the FAV sequence displays a tooltip- if you shrink the window sufficiently it can look really neat.

[ElizabethD]

Build 9
I put a note on the previous post (I could have deleted it, but if someone already read it, it would be unfair).
I can't replicate the up/down issue. Perhaps java needed to settle down. Or I just messed with a file too much. Or a reboot did it. It's working fine.

Tooltips seem to behave perfectly nicely so you don't need my file & pics.
Prompt for attempt to exit without saving works fine.